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Re: Desktop look...
by Will Stokes on Friday 08/Feb/2002, @09:04
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I'd agree with you, but I'd also like to have scalable icons in KDE. It's one of the things OSX has that I wish I had under kde. Hell, a scalable kicker would rock!
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Re: Desktop look...
by Ian Reinhart Geiser on Friday 08/Feb/2002, @10:09
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so please submit a patch.
i am busy makeing it possible to script KDE applications with any scripting language you chose. i think IBM/HP and compaq want that a little bit more than icons that grow and shrink. i think what tacket, qwertz and other provide is adiquate.
i would not trade dirk and davids work on KHTML for any eyecandy no matter what it does for me.
-ian reinhart geiser
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Re: Desktop look...
by Michael Collette on Friday 08/Feb/2002, @13:55
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Amen!
So far as scaleable icons, when I have added new ones in manually (stuff only to show up on my desktop) I usually only make one big one (48x48). From what I'm seeing here, they scale quite nicely already. No, it's not the super spiffy kind of scaling you'd get with vectored graphics... so?
As a user, I want rock solid KHTML, Javascript, improvements to the Address book, better Palm integration, performance boosts. I want, I want, I want! :) These are the make and break points of KDE. Besides, I happen to strongly prefer Liquid to Aqua after using both. KDE already looks very very sweet!
As much as I'm looking forward to seeing KDE3, what I've got now is working pretty nicely. Take your time, miss some promised release dates, and do us all proud! You KDE developer types have gotten us all used to them kinds of things, especially the proud part.
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Re: Desktop look...
by Gnomer on Friday 08/Feb/2002, @10:17
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> For giggles ask a gnomer to change their wallpaper from the commandline...
> without restarting anything, when they cry that it cannot be done, fire up DCOP
And by the time DCOP has fired up, esetroot is finished and a background is changed. Wow. Being able to change the background from the commandline. I feel more productive already.
Then we think of the applications that wipe the floor with anything KDE has...Evolution...hmm, Gnumeric...Abiword...I'll keep quiet now shall I?
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Re: Desktop look...
by dave on Friday 08/Feb/2002, @13:27
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nah, don't stop there, add the gimp, galeon, gnucash, mrproject and a little thing called Red-Carpet. (great apps, gotta love 'em)
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Re: Desktop look...
by Ian Reinhart Geiser on Friday 08/Feb/2002, @13:54
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KSpread, - Like GNUmeric only it dosent crash as much and has better integration
KWord - Like Abiword only more features, granted thats not that hard
KPresenter - Like... well... i dunno
Kivio - Like dia only with a more powerful python/xml based shape engine
Kate - what gedit always wanted to be
Quanta - I think bluefish tries to be an html editor
KDevelop - makes GIDE look like a booger, but then again no one actually writes
gnome code, it just happens...
Konqi - about 1/2 the size of mozzila, which is not even a true gnome app anyway,
they just wish it was
FYI not only to all of these talk together but they are accessabe with dcop. GNOME is a lose hack of any application they can get ahold of, while KDE seems to have some method behind its development. Oh and that red carpets a real winner... I watched it hoze my mandrake box... but i give them points for trying...
KDE development may not have the alure to 1st year CS dropouts, but it seems to have a fairly stable following...
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Re: Desktop look...
by Dr_LHA on Friday 08/Feb/2002, @14:46
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> KSpread, - Like GNUmeric only it dosent crash as much and has better integration
Have you actually tried Gnumeric > 1.0 with Guppi. It's excellent.
> KWord - Like Abiword only more features, granted thats not that hard
Abiword at least started from a stable base, i.e. the ability to do WYSIWYG printing. I can't believe anyone would write a word processor and not consider the ability to print the most vital feature! Don't knock Abiword, it may be simple - but it does the job 99% of the time.
> Kivio - Like dia only with a more powerful python/xml based shape engine
Sorry - but have you actually tried to use Kivio or Dia? I actually decided to use to produce some professional flow charts for ESA documentation and they both suck.
> Konqi - about 1/2 the size of Mozilla
But Galeon is the gnome browser and to be honest - it's what I use all the time now.
Also Evolution beats the crap out of any KDE mail/pim program and I seriously think that KDE should dump kpilot and go with gpilotd which actually works (Evolution calendar syncs beautifully with my Palm).
For the record I use KDE2.2.2 as my desktop - but that doesn't precude me from using gnome apps if I think they're better for my productivity. I'm looking forward to the next release of KOffice alot, but at the moment - I'll stick with whats best for the job.
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Re: Desktop look...
by Sean Russell on Friday 08/Feb/2002, @17:30
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> Abiword at least started from a stable base, i.e. the ability to do WYSIWYG printing. I can't believe anyone would
> write a word processor and not consider the ability to print the most vital feature! Don't knock Abiword, it may be
> simple - but it does the job 99% of the time.
I have to disagree. Anything that Abiword is adequate for, I've found, I might as well use vi for. Any non-trivial document I've ever written requires features not found in Abiword.
That said, KWord isn't much better. My wife, an author, can't use KWord because, as of the latest stable release, printing is still screwed up. However, at least it has styles, an absolute minimum for any document over a page or two.
One thing I *really* like about Abiword is the export to docbook. I wish KWord would adopt this. If I had more time, I'd write a couple of XSLT stylesheets to convert between the two. Actually, Abiword's export and import facilities far outshine KWords, unless you're only interested in MSWord imports, in which case KWord's is marginally better, and both are vastly inferior to StarOffice.
> For the record I use KDE2.2.2 as my desktop - but that doesn't precude me from using gnome apps if I think they're
> better for my productivity. I'm looking forward to the next release of KOffice alot, but at the moment - I'll stick
> with whats best for the job.
IMHO, unless you need rigid control over formatting, KWord is much superior to Abiword. Printing is sufficient, as long as (as I said) you aren't trying to do a resume, or something that requires true WYSIWYG.
But, in the end, StarOffice still beats the pants off of either, in both printing and features. It's a memory hog, but it is the only real alternative to MSWord for people who's jobs depend on a good word processor.
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Re: Desktop look...
by Ricardo Galli on Wednesday 13/Feb/2002, @15:29
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One thing I *really* like about Abiword is
the export to docbook. I wish KWord would adopt this.
See last section in
http://bulmalug.net/body.phtml?nIdNoticia=1061.
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Re: Desktop look...
by dave on Saturday 09/Feb/2002, @10:03
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I've tried koffice numerous times in the past, and it has never lasted long enough for me to be able to create a document and save it (kword, kspread, kpresenter...), so i use gnumeric and abiword, they're fast and they just dont crash for me - it's interesting that you've tried gnumeric and found it unstable, have you tried a recent version? i use the latest ximian version from red-carpet on redhat 7.2 and it's really stable.
True abiword is lacking some features, but what it does it does well, and it has .doc export.
I've never really used gide myself, so i can't comment on that but anjuta is ok (and more like kdevelop) - however i still prefer codewarrior.
Quanta - yup that's good, (although if i just want to edit html bluefish is also very good)
konqueror is fine as a file manager, but in my opinion it's not the best web browser - that's galeon.
Kivio - never tried it, but i have used dia and it's a bit annoying.
Red-Carpet - it works for me and it's great, but i do get the impression that it's not so great for mandrake.
It really sounds like we're not comparing equals here, kde's unstable for me (on redhat 7.2, with redhat updates) and it dsounds like gnome's unstable for you on mandrake.
It's a real shame that this should be the case because there are 2 great desktops out there and it looks like the distributors don't put enough effort into testing both of them. I guess i'll have to wait and see if kde3's any better and you can try gnome2 when that comes out.
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Re: Desktop look...
by oliv on Monday 11/Feb/2002, @04:47
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I'm a kde user, so I think I'm not too gnome oriented, but what you say is really shoking, as it's just wrong.
Kspread/Gnumeric: Not only it has less functions that Gnumeric, but I can crash it in less than 5 seconds (just adding some charts in it). Gnumeric is one of the rare Gnome/Gtk apps that really has a lead compared to KDE equivalent.
Abiword/Kword: You cannot ignore that abiword is much better at preview and wysiwyg than Kword.
Kdevelop vs Gide. Shouldn't you compare it to glade?
Quanta: If you are talking about Quanta +, I have to disagree. The functionalities of bluefish actually work. Some functionalities of quanta are just checkboxes without effect. Bluefish is really far better than Quanta+.
Konqui may use half the size of Mozilla, it is not a comparble application! Why do you compare Konqui to Mozilla?! Can you write email, do icq and compose html pages in Konqueror? I'm not even sure it can display PNG transparency. TIP: Nautilus
And I'm a KDE user. I happen to use some gnome apps because they are better for some situations.
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Re: Desktop look...
by mike.s on Tuesday 12/Feb/2002, @08:48
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I think Anjuta is a lot better that kdevelop ... although in it's early stage.
But probably it's a matter of preference - I prefer an IDE whith a great Editor
since this is the part I use at most when programming.
The kdevelop team did a great job but the editor is way behind what other
IDEs provide.
And I miss ksodipodi ;)
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Re: Desktop look...
by purity on Wednesday 13/Feb/2002, @11:35
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nah, kdevelop is much more like THE ide that all other ide's live up to, MS VisualStudio. It's also much more mature and stable in development than something like ajunta, but then again, it has been development in 4 years. I agree with you in the editor part tho, although scintilla, which is used by ajunta, isn't THAT much better. Once kdevelop uses the kate part (soon), it'll blow everything else away again ;)
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Re: Desktop look...
by me on Friday 08/Feb/2002, @13:38
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Before you complain that the theme is too slow try it. In this case slow on a 400Mhz machine should be read "as slow as kde2 on the same machine", i just tried it - maybe you should too.
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Re: Desktop look...
by andrew on Friday 08/Feb/2002, @16:58
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All of you, grow up. This whole thread sounds like, "My desktop can beat up your desktop." Some like KDE, and some like GNOME. It's nice to have the choice. Even better, it's nice to have the choice of two really great FREE desktop environments. Use the applications that you think work the best or that you are most comfortable with. Knocking someone else's work is just rude (and this applies to everybody).
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