don't you forget about me (la la la....)

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don't you forget about me (la la la....)
by borker on Friday 04/Aug/2006, @10:10

<i>My personal goal is to make KDevelop 4 so good that core KDE developers like Zack Rusin (Emacs guy) and Aaron Seigo (Vim guy) just have to switch. Zack and Aaron will tell you that this is not an easy goal to accomplish. I'll be very happy if KDevelop 4 becomes the release known for converting the KDE core developers into KDevelop users.</i>

Loved reading this article and like this as a goal for KDev, I just would also like to suggest that you keep new to KDE developers in mind with KD4.

I've been coding for a long time but it's been ages since i wrote C++ and I've never previously written KDE/Qt code. I know that CMake is coming and that it's files should be easier for humans to parse, but going by my KDE3 experience so far, learning the KDE build system and dealing with the MOC and UI files and generally coming to grips with build process has been tricky. I'd love to see KDevelop, as much as possible/practical, be as educational as possible for new KDE / Qt developers, obviously with the ability to still be as stream lined and uninvasive for experienced developers as well.

One idea for this type of thing could be an (optionally) more verbose project creation wizard that not only lets you set up all the starting parameters for a project but seeks to explain what you should be thinking about when setting a given parameter and how it relates to the overall KDE build process etc.

I guess overall, the easier it is for people such as myself to pick up KDE/Qt development the quicker we can get to actually helping out rather than just writing trivial apps as a learning exercise.

Related Links

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Re: don't you forget about me (la la la....)
by manyoso on Friday 04/Aug/2006, @10:29

I don't think the two are mutually exclusive. By in large, core KDE developers just want something that works too.

Mattr is already working on CMake support in our project manager. Hopefully you'll have to edit by hand as little as possible, but if you do, it should be easier to grok.

We are really trying to concentrate on simplifying things. For instance, in current KDevelop 3.x we have 4 or 5 different places where you can set environment variables:

1. The Make configuration.
2. The Configure configuration.
3. The Run configuration.
4. The Qt configuration.

In KDevelop 4, you'll have ONE place to set and see all of your environment variables. Every sub process that KDevelop 4 launches will use these environment variable settings. And the embedded konsole should also use them. That's my goal at least. We want to make things as simple and straightforward as possible, but we don't want to lose the power.

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Re: don't you forget about me (la la la....)
by borker on Friday 04/Aug/2006, @10:59

I agree completely, I don't think the needs of the experts and those of novices are mutually exclusive at all and certainly simplify make params etc will help everyone across the experience spectrum. I guess what I'm getting at is that it would be neat if KDevelop did a bit more hand holding for those of us who need it, whilst staying out of the way of those who don't.

One of the things I've loved about picking up Qt/KDE was how quickly you can make non-trivial applications, but I found learning Qt/KDE was a weird reverse... rather than writing code first and then learning the complexities of the build process later, as required, I found myself needing to come up to speed with the build process first and then write code. Not being overly familiar with the GNU tool chain didn't help speed up this process either. I found it to be a frustrating blocker to actually writing code and it wasn't helped by most of the available tutorials being great on coding advice but very slim on build advice, so when I wanted to go from 'hello world' to something a bit more 'real world' I ran smack into the build system and all my momentum died completely. Anything that could help a beginner like me out in the way of teach as you go type stuff would be great.

This is all just wish list stuff of course... I love kdevelop and kde coding in general. I can't wait until I can finally start to contribute something.

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Re: don't you forget about me (la la la....)
by Pepe Corvina on Saturday 05/Aug/2006, @11:04

The same happened with me. Most of the QT/KDE tutorials totally ommit the building process and or KDevelop/QT-Designer integration...

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Re: don't you forget about me (la la la....)
by manyoso on Sunday 06/Aug/2006, @10:17

Hi, i wrote this inspired by your comment:

http://www.kdedevelopers.org/node/2224

Cheers!

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Re: don't you forget about me (la la la....)
by borker on Tuesday 08/Aug/2006, @06:36

Nice one, thats a handy resource :)

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