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  The Road to KDE 4: Amarok 2 Development is Underway
KDE Public Relations and Marketing Posted by Troy Unrau on Monday 12/Mar/2007, @21:56
from the rediscovering-how-to-rediscover-your-music dept.
This week we'll take a brief look at some of the many features that are making their way into Amarok 2, which is the development branch for Amarok in KDE 4. The features discussed are all in-progress features which have reached varying stages of completion. Read on for information about Amarok's engines (including Phonon), UI changes, changes to the Magnatune music store, OS X support, and more.

A few weeks ago, The Road to KDE 4 featured an article on Phonon. When that article was published, work on Amarok 2 had not yet started, but the Phonon developers were keeping Amarok very much in mind as they designed the Phonon libraries.

You see, in Amarok 1.x, the developers had to maintain separate playback engines for xine, gstreamer, aKode, etc. This was somewhat of a hassle to keep all of these engines up to date, and in some cases, they were very much a moving target, forcing them to focus on only a single engine, xine. And other programs, like Noatun had to re-implement these backends so there was much duplication of efforts. For KDE 4, the Phonon interface is designed so that programs like Amarok don't have to worry so much about the backends anymore and can concentrate on the other parts of the application. According to the Amarok developers, implementing a Phonon backend took all of 90 minutes before it was usable, and a few extra hours before it was fully implemented. When using Phonon, applications can playfiles over network protocols thanks to KIO, so we'll see what happens as the Amarok team explores this feature in more detail.

So Phonon is now working in Amarok 2. The old engines were also ported over, and in particular, the old xine engine is still being actively developed and they haven't decided to drop their old engines. Since Amarok 2 has only been in development for a few weeks, it is too early to decide to drop their existing engines such as xine, which has served Amarok very well in the past.

One of the side effects of using Phonon is that Amarok can access the video playback functions of the underlying engines where they exist, such as in the phonon-xine engine. They have added rudimentary support for video playback in Amarok, but it's designed to complement audio playback, rather than supplant more involved video players like Kaffeine. The idea is that if you have a music video in your collection, and want to use Amarok to play music from that video, then the video stream would be considered as a Visualization for that music. Having video support will in no way hinder your Amarok audio experience in version 2. According to Dan Meltzer, adding initial video support was a whole seven lines of code using Phonon.

Of course, thanks to KDE 4's newfound portability, Amarok is able to run on other platforms, not just Unix/X11. The development version has already made its first appearance on OS X thanks to the work of Benjamin Reed. Porting to Windows as well is underway, although I don't have a screenshot of that progress.

Amarok 2 on Mac

I personally think that having Amarok on these platforms will single-handedly do more for awareness of KDE as a multi-OS development platform than any other application that currently exists for KDE, since the program is head and shoulders above so many other media players out there.

But they wouldn't have a good reason to call it 2.0 unless there were some really big changes happening, and there are.

Amarok is in many ways inspired by XMMS, which in turn bears a lot of resemblance to Winamp. Basically, it's a music player with a multi-column playlist that displays information from tags contained within the media files. Now, these multi-column playlists have not really changed much over the last decade, except that different applications have added interesting ways to sort, filter, and edit tags. Amarok is particularly good at sorting and filtering, and half decent at tag editing (see JuK as an example of a player with an amazing tag editor). But none of these functions really require Amarok to present its playlist in a rigid column format, except for traditional reasons. So as part of the UI reworking for Amarok 2, the playlist is seeing a rebirth of sorts. While it still lists Tracks, Titles, and other tags, it will no longer be constrained by the old fashioned playlist column format.

This requires a picture to properly describe, so here is a mockup showing the concept in action.

Amarok 2 Mockup

You may first wonder "Where is the playlist?" as I and a few of my peers on IRC initially wondered, but if you look closely, the list on the right is actually the playlist, only it's broken free from its old format. So now, when your file is missing some tags, the playlist will simply adjust around those missing tags, smartly displaying what information it does have.

Also featured prominently in this screenshot is the middle pane. This pane is the focus of Amarok 2, as they try to give you more information about your current track, and allowing you to "Rediscover Your Music" as their motto goes. The leftmost column will function much as it used to, except with the "Context" information moved to the centre. Of course, as is KDE tradition, much of this will be configurable.

Here is a shot of Amarok 1.4.5 showing its current layout for comparison as well as a shot of the development branch of Amarok showing off some of the progress they've made in moving user interface elements around. The mockup above is the targeted UI they wish to achieve, but there will be bumps and changes along the way as they find what does and does not work well.

Amarok 1.4.5 in KDE 3.5.6

And now another screen the Amarok 2.0 development version, this time on Linux. Keep in mind that Amarok 2 has only been in development for a single month, and work is still ongoing.

Amarok 2 in KDE 4 on linux

One of the most promising of Amarok's features is Magnatune store integration. According to Wikipedia: Magnatune is an independent record label which aims at treating both its musicians and its customers fairly. Users can stream and download music in MP3 format without charge before making a decision whether tobuy or not. Music files sold by Magnatune do not use any form of Digital Rights Management to prevent customers from making copies of music files they have purchased; and actually encourage buyers to share up to three copies with friends.

Amarok debuted with Magnatune support (for both audio streaming and purchase) in version 1.4.4. Since then, the team has received many emails from other stores interested in being added to Amarok as well. But in Amarok 1.4, the developers have been busy polishing up Magnatune support and had no manpower to start bigger tasks. With Amarok 1.4.5, the second version of the Magnatune store was released and developers are really pleased with that version. It works well, and generates a small but growing number of sales for Magnatune.

So it is time to move on. Nikolaj Hald Nielsen, the main developer of Magnatune store, is planning to move things up a higher level by providing a service framework for all streaming music sources. This service framework could, and is in part intended to, be used as a starting point for adding other stores, and will provide a large amount of basic functionality with regards to adding previews to the playlist, displaying data about selected items, and similar "read only" functionality. As a prof of concept, a service that can be controlled using scripts have been implemented on top of this framework. Currently there is no intent to make a framework for the more store specific functionality (purchasing, parsing of info from websites), simply because each store has their own unique way of handling these things. Nevertheless, it's a great step forward for unified streamed music support in Amarok, and in fact, the CoolStreams service has been already ported to this new framework (as a rubyscript), and a Shoutcast browser is coming along.

Now, with the Magnatune store well received and with the possibility of using the service framework, it might be time to contact some of these interested music stores again.

Here is a screenshot showing the experimental "Cool Streams" ruby script running on top of the scriptable service:

Services browser in amarok 2

If you'd like to get involved in the Amarok 2 development process, you will need to set up a KDE 4 development environment. There are instructions for using SVN available at the KDE TechBase website, or use the kdesvn-build program to automate the whole thing. The Amarok developers accept patches, and will hook you up with SVN access if you require it. They also need help from artists, testers, and people to offer user support via the #amarok IRC channel on the freenode network.

Ladies and Gentlemen, Amarok 2 is progressing very rapidly. To quote Mark Kretschmann, Amarok's lead developer: "If development continues at this pace, we'll be done with Amarok 3 by the time KDE 4 is out ;)" Be prepared for something awesome, as you've come to expect from the Amarok team.

To stay up to date with Amarok news, check out the Amarok Newsletter published by Ljubomir Simin. Special thanks for his contributions to this article. It's my first experience co-authoring, and it went very smoothly. :)



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Over 40 comments listed. Printing out index only.
New GUI sucks
by Luis on Monday 12/Mar/2007, @22:57
Isn't just ugly, It's unusable.
Even the concept art look bad, I am quietly sure most user will prefer the OLD GUI style, because it's simpler and more useful, BTW, the amarok 1.4 screenshot it's soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo manipulated, it's just don't look that way, maybe by default, and whit any cover, but I dosen't look that way for most user, common!
Click to download attachment fondo1.jpg
108KB (111485 bytes)

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No!
by No on Monday 12/Mar/2007, @23:38
No no no. This mockup looks bad! Really bad.
Don't try to invent a bike. Take current amarok gui, and try to improve it.
That's what we need, not some iTunes/WMP clone. Amarok now looks different, and that's good.
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Amarok 2
by Bill Leeper on Monday 12/Mar/2007, @23:42
Well, I think the new UI looks very nice. And since I have used Magnatune long before I discovered Amarok that is one feature I really like. The new version looks very interesting.
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Old fashion look
by Konrad on Monday 12/Mar/2007, @23:50
I really like the old fashion look Amarok 1.4.5 presents. It's very usable with playlist on the right side with headers under columns displying relevant information. I can simply find tracks sorting them by size, lenght, bitrate and especially type and directory. It's gaining power from it's simplicity, that's why people like Winamp UI, they don't have to think too much to find how to use GUI. To much sophistiated interface could overwhelm new users coming from Windows and MacOS camp. For the time being my female cousin Paula really like Amarok and she is not techncian. So, don't make another app for nerds and geeks, when you must go with learning curve to just play few songs.
Best regards to all Amarok developers, you really do great job:)
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Great work!
by frodoontop on Monday 12/Mar/2007, @23:51
Developing this fast is impressive. In this very early state, it's already looking very good. And also quite innovative, I like that. Ofcourse I can't say anything about usability yet. But I'll trust that is in save hands by the Amarok team :)
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new GUI
by Emil Sedgh on Monday 12/Mar/2007, @23:54
I really love the new GUI (Mockup).thats really usable.I think the current Context Browser has a big problem: Its tabs.I hate those tabs (Music/Lyrics/Wikipedia).everytime im in one of them, I miss the others.I really want to see them all merged.(A brief wikipedia text and image that could be extended by a collapsing 'Hide'Show' link + lyrics in a HTML Frame (should have scroll bars) + Similliar artists/Favourite albums and... below that)

but since everyone wants his own things, i was thinking about Templating that (think about Smarty in PHP, something simmiliar that everyone creates his own 'Contex Bar Themes'.not only CSS)
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The New UI
by Sarath on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @00:25
Please don't make the new UI the default. Its very cumbersome, and non intuitive. The current UI doesn't have much quirks imho, maybe you can just fold the tabs together or something like that - but definitely, not this way.
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tag cloud
by cossidhon on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @00:30
Maybe a good idea to have an option to display a tag cloud (like on Flickr) on the middle pane to select music. Another comment I would like to make: Why not use (dynamic) treeviews more to cut down on the number of tabs.

Keep up the good work!
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Keep going...
by Steve on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @01:02
Keep going where you're going, amarok devs. Regardless of people's disapproval (at least until you're finished). You've created good things in the past, and I hope everyone can trust you to do so again.
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CoverFlow
by KAMiKAZOW on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @01:33
Zack Rusin has written a CoverFlow clone for Qt4. If you Amarok developers want to integrate that:
http://zrusin.blogspot.com/2007/03/reflections.html

Like some other people, I'm not that excited about the new playlist.
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nice job
by chris on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @01:50
I like the look of the mockup. Really, I don't care if it's inspired by something else, and I think complaining about it is pointless. It displays all the information the traditional playlist but in a more elegant and compact fashion. Keep up the great work!
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I like it but...
by Cypher on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @01:51
I really like the new Amarok but... I'm much more focusing on my collection than on the context browser. When the Amarok window is shown on my desktop, it's because I want to change the content of my playlist. Otherwise it's closed in the tray. I really think you're focusing on the wrong thing. Of course the context browser is really usefull and I use it, but not as much as the collection pane, which is, let's be honest, crap... I like to go through my collection the same way as I go through my shelves... looking at the covers. I must admit, even if I'm going to risk my life ;-), that the WMP Collection Manager is really well done, usefull, easy to use... At least it shows the covers in a configurable size next to the tracks. And that's the only thing I'm looking at, I don't want to bother reading the tags if I'm not looking for a song in particular. And it shows the track number and the length of the songs as well, in case I need them, which is not even implemented in Amarok. Every back cover of a CD has that information but not the collection manager, that's... weird isn't it ? The TreeView widget is definitely not a good choice for displaying a collection IMO.


So please focus on the collection manager, and make it more useable. Make it feel like wood... as a normal shelf, with real CD's on it.
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Looking good!
by bsander on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @02:20
I really like the mockup. I've always been annoyed with having a 1440px widescreen and still not being able to see all the information I'd like to (I always have to resize the left pane if I use it), so I really like the way you guys are heading :)

I do hope that the playlist will still be one-click sortable on for example artist or rating, since I didn't see that functionality in the mockup and I kind of use that a lot.

I also agree with Emil Sedgh that tabs in the new middle pane should be avoided at all costs, I hope it'll be possible to present all the information in one view without cluttering the pane up too much.

Again, great work (and great article, too)!
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What about podcasts?
by Torsten on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @02:28
I'd like a little more supprt for podcasts. Now it is still a pain in the ass. You have to scroll down the playlists to the podcasts, refresh the podcasts and download them - then you can hear to them or transfer the files to your mp3-player.

Would it be possible to do it a little more like mypodder from podcastready.com? Every time I connect my MP3-Player the programm loads the most recent - or maybe the three most recent - podcast episodes to the device.
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Drag and Drop
by Stuart Neill on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @02:30
I do like the the look of the proposed interface, however, as shown, there is one obvious showstopper for me. When populating the Playlist from the Collection panel, you will have to drag across the central panel. This is much worse than the present arrangement.
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A good direction
by Sero on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @02:58
I like the mockup and I am happy to see the progress in amarok2 to resamble the ideas of the mockup.

What I disliked the most on "old" (alreday great) amarok: sidebar + tabs and not fitting that great on a widescreen display.

What I liked the most on the mockup: no tabs and sidebar ;-) Besides this, the items of the UI are very sensible grouped in the mockup. You have the "control area" on top that sticks on ones eyes because of the colored background (hope this will find it's way into the code some day). You have your collection to the left, the context info at the center ("show lyrics" and such would be nice to have here as "links" cause we don't want any tabs, right?). The playlist to the right is great as well - it is beautiful, informative and needs much less horizontal space as the "classic" playlist. In general I like the "flat" "htmlish" look of the mockup (well, that might be because it's a mockup). I hope you guys manage to resamble that look with qt4.

What came into my mind when I read the artice: the new mockup ideal is IMHO _much_ better then the experimental context-browser/playlist merge that was introduced in an amarok-1.X-beta (and then delayed). So please don't say amarok devs don't care about there users. This mockup seems to be very well though of.

Keep on the great work!
Sero
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visual appearence of mockup
by tuxedup on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @04:08
I think the mockup for Ammarok 2.0 looks rather smart. Its clear easy to follow. Hopefully each of the panes will be reszable so that the playlist pane can be made wider.

What I dislike about the mockup is the controls and visualisation along the top. Firstly they seem out of reach along thwe top compared to there possition with the 1.x series. Secondly they donot fit in properly in terms of visualr look. The shole background shifting colour looks out of place and rather windows vista to me. If they were to remove the colour blending and have the background the same colour as the rest of the application back ground (in the same way as the current 1.x series does), or even just not bother changing appearence of the controls section (they work perfectly fine at the moment and are visually pleasing) then the mockup would be perfect.

If the controls section were to change to how it currently looks then the mockup would be perfect. I would certaintly use it.
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What the users *really* want...
by fish on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @04:30
- Tabbed playlists
- A fullscreen mode
- Multiple collections
- Volume normalization without a need for scripts
- Recording / capturing streaming media to disk
- A better use of covers (maybe similar to Cower Flow)
- More data from last.fm integrated into Amarok

This is what the users want, and this is what should be added to Amarok 2.0.

Nobody asked for a GUI refactoring, but everybody asks for the above features...

So which of those features will make it in Amarok 2.0? That's the really important question here, not the GUI...
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JACK support yet ?
by Dave Phillips on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @04:57
I like Amarok, and I've briefly reviewed it in my blog for the Linux Journal at http://www.linuxjournal.com/node/1000181. For me, its most glaring lack is stable support for JACK. Gstreamer's JACK back-end is in need of maintenance (last time I checked), and I'm not sure what xine's current status is re: JACK. Give Amarok clean JACK audio support and it'll be the bee's kness for me. :)
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gui
by CHX on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @05:25
The new gui doesn't look good. There (on the mockup) the tracks rows height is big, so you can't see many of them on one sreen.

Can you please leave the old style as an option?
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I like the old look better....
by Meister Lampe on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @05:39
First of all: you guys are doing a great job, keep up the good work.

One of the reasons I like the old GUI better is: I think it's a bad idea to use 3 columns. It's just too much. Think of it: every professional program/website has 2 columns...

ML
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new appeareance...
by Jean-Baptiste on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @05:55
I think that, on one hand, there are some great innovations with news GUI, but on the other hand, other innovations are just trying to change the user interface because of changing it : well, it's not the good way.

There should have been some example mockup releases before to begin the development. As some others, I think, for example, that the context menu, shouldn't be there, in the middle of the window. Because, yes, the context menu is good looking in himself, but I don't look at it so much when I'm workin'.
And I think that, the common use of Amarok is, listening music when you're working. You just want to see Amarok icon in the system tray. When the playlist is finished, you click on it, and drag&drop some other files in the playlist.

There is something I like yet, it's that the playlist informations are not in columns anymore. The informations are integrated in the file line (I hope you see what I mean...) : author, time, notation etc.. (see mockup).

I also think that, the collection should take more place, and should more use CD-covers. The collection is one of the things that made I decided to migrate to Linux & KDE : I didn't find this on Xmms.

And to finish this message, I'll say that : Yeah ! the menu, with navigation buttons (play, pause, next, previous etc...), is great. It's large, usable, with great graphics...but it should be on the bottom, not on top.
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I like the current layout
by Ben Morris on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @06:27
Please tell me there will be an option to make Amarok use the current main window layout? I don't think the new one looks as good (yet), and also it doesn't really leave enough space for people like me who want to see 7 or 8 columns of metadata for their playlist. More customisability of layout wouldn't be bad. Being stuck with a layout like the mockup would be bad for a lot of people who really like the current GUI.

IMHO, Amarok's current GUI is very good, certainly the best of any existing audio player (being easier to use than iTunes is pretty impressive, given that iTunes is supposed to be built for simplicity and Amarok is purposefully feature-rich). Phonon support, scriptable services and all that are cool additions but it would be a shame if the stuff which is already almost perfect were changed just because it's The 2.0 Release.
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Well...
by Cypher on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @06:29
Ladies and Gentlemen, Amarok 2 is progressing very rapidly. To quote Mark Kretschmann, Amarok's lead developer: "If development continues at this pace, we'll be done with Amarok 3 by the time KDE 4 is out ;)" Be prepared for something awesome, as you've come to expect from the Amarok team.

--------------------------------------------------

According to the comments I've read so far, they've got enough work ahead to match users' needs instead of implementing what they thought was the best ;)

Keep it up team, we're not asking for Amarok3, just a really good Amarok2 will be enough ;-)
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I am looking foward
by tikal26 on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @07:38
I am looking forward for it, I like the mockup and I don;t think that it looks too much like itunes. I really like that the middle pane with information is taking special attention since I listen to a bunch of podcasts and its a pint to go trough the play list and then having to click on the bottom button (show more information)and maximizing an minimizing the info just to see what the podcast includes. I am also glad that you have added basic video support( I hope you keep it basic) and I am looking forward to see what other features are implemented.
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added features
by donniedarko on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @08:02
I would love to see a skin optimized for small touch screens. I have a car pc with 7" screen and so far you either get a gui that's easier to use with features like giant buttons, but doesn't navigate through music collections well or great navigation but buttons and title info just a bit too small.
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bad, just bad
by anon on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @08:13
GUI looks terrible. Just terrible. Kinda looks like the alignment has 100 different rules and nothing is following it. Images look really basic, like something from windows 3.1.
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Hmmmm
by UA=42 on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @08:29
I do allot of copying from the files tab to the playlist. With the new layout, one will have to drag over the context menu, and then into the appropriate place in the playlist. I think that is the main downside to the new proposed GUI. The other downside being that if I want all the current info that I like using (Artist, length, album, score, stars) and have the context menu open.... would require allot of width.

I would have to agree that if you do go with this GUI, the old Gui should be an option.
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Looks great
by Leo S on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @08:30
I like the new look. Can't wait to use it.

Two things I'd like to see in Amarok 2
- Fetching context information for internet streams (Context info doesn't work for radioparadise.com for example, and since context is such a central focus of the app, it should always work)

- I know its not easy to do with the current toolbar approach to buttons, but it is very nice when the important buttons are bigger than the less important ones. Like Play is bigger than skip.. Windows media player does this and it works quite well. http://www.winsupersite.com/images/showcase/wmp11_xp_15.jpg
Not that you should copy that layout, but I like the idea of making the play button more visually prominent than the others.
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Looking forward amarok2 and suggestions...
by Dareus on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @08:43
I really can't wait to have amarok2.0 but I would like to suggest a pair of things to devs.
I think amarok is going the right way with new functions and gui but is important to remember features we're waiting amarok2.0 for.
Concerning gui I think an implementation for amarokfs cuold be great; to use it as screen-saver or anti-geek.
About collection imho a full implementation of what regards bug 119539 or 90095 could be great.
http://bugs.kde.org/buglist.cgi?product=amarok&bug_status=UNCONFIRMED&bug_status=NEW&bug_status=ASSIGNED&bug_status=REOPENED
Another thing about collection is that it's not necessary to show it when playing something; a better way to show all we want to see in it is it to have collection screen-wide (and so not together with playlist and contest browser).
I also think that in the middle of the screen it has to be what a user uses mostly, not what is thougth to be important (eg. I prefer having infos, which I read quite often, on one side most likely than in the center).
Anyway amrok is great and for what I've seen about it will continue to be so.
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middle pane
by nardew on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @08:47
i think that middle pane is useless and it takes a lot of usable space in the window. i use amarok for playing and listening to the music, not for reading some information about artist, which i am not interested in. yes, it could be an optional feature, but i think it shouln't be there by default. try to replace it with something useful.
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I would rather see KPlayer ported to KDE 4!
by Give me KPlayer on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @09:02
I would very much rather see KPlayer ported to KDE 4. I really like its multimedia library far better than all the Amarok clutter.

In KPlayer everything is very clean, only the really necessary stuff is shown by default. And the multimedia library is so easy to use, and never gets in your way.

I just set up a few playlists, and then closed the library window because I don't need it anymore. All the playlists I made are on the File menu, very easy to click and play.

I wish all KDE programs were that simple, flexible and powerful at the same time. Oh, and KPlayer will never ever pop up any stupid flashy window right in your face when you are in the middle of something else.
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UI
by The Digital Pioneer on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @09:44
Man, what are you people bashing the UI for? I like the new UI. It looks really cool! It's probably not done yet, so just wait and maybe they'll improve it to your liking. :)

And to the Amarok devs, perhaps an option as to whether to use the old UI or new UI is in order.
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Second screenshot
by Francois on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @09:59
I love the concept of the second screenshot. It's realy cool to be able to get information about the band that's currently playing, and to get it in a readable way.
I wasn't convinced about the playlist but thinking about it, it can actually be quite cool.

One thing it would be cool to have is to be able to get information about another band than the one currently playing. I don't how that should be handle. But when you're with friends and trying to remember the name of that guitarist in whatever band, it would be great to go the collection and be able to right click (for instance) and get information about the selected band displayed in the center panel.
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Windows version
by WPosche on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @10:31
If they manage to finish Amarok 2.0 before KDE 4.0 is released they could already release the Windows version. Some of my Windows friends really like Amarok when they see it on my PC but are just not yet ready to switch to Linux just for one app. If they could already enjoy Amarok before the final release of KDE 4.0, that would be awesome.
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I love Amarok
by Gabriel Gazzán on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @10:38
...and I really trust in its developers. They have proven again and again that they know what they do. Keep going!

If I were to ask something for Amarok, be it 2.0 or 1.x, is that I'd like it to start quickier when double clicking files in Konqueror.
I still miss good old Winamp for that reason, currently Amarok takes too long to load a song, even when it's already running.

Thx!
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maybe, maybe not
by redeeman on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @10:39
That mockup doesent really look so good to me, but ofcourse i havent tried it, and the amarok developers has previously created awesome stuff, so it cant really be decided untill the product is on the table, and at that time i will give it a full go as it deserves, and i probably will end up like it, as with the current amarok.
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Syncing with MP3 players
by kwilliam on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @11:02
Developers: Don't listen to all the GUI whiners! Amarok is the sweetest music player I've ever encountered, and I fully trust you guys/gals will do a great job with Amarok 2.

My only request is that you keep improving the ability to sync with portable media devices. I love the on-the-fly file type conversion, and would like to have more control over that. My MP3 player is only 1 GB, and since I mostly listen to it while I exercise, I'd like it if Amarok could re-encode the files to smaller file sizes when it transfers them to my music player. The treadmill lowers the sound quality anyway, and I could definately do with fitting more songs on it!
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On a positive note
by bigtomrodney on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @11:29
I'm only taking the time to post because I see so much negative feedback. I liked the mockup, but moreover I like the pace and enthusiasm with which Amarok has been developed. You haven't dissapointed me so far so I'm more than happy to put my trust in you :D
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Two groups
by Matt on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @11:59
It sounds like there are 2 main groups of people here commenting.

One uses the context browser and loves the new UI.

The other doesn't use it and hates the new UI.

I think just making the panes collapsible would get rid of a lot of the complaints.
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Double-edged sword
by Louis on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @12:39
While I really love this "Road to..." series, it sure does stir up a lot of premature discontent. It seems that each week, the writers add more and more preemptive "this is pre-alpha" warnings, but the negative comments just keep piling up. I hope nobody gets discouraged by all the negativity. I love being able to read these great articles to get insight into the development process, but the negative responses are overwhelming. I wouldn't start belly-aching until release is a little closer.
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Stability first?
by Richard Neill on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @13:31
Might I suggest spending a little time focusing on stability? Unfortunately, I've always found amarok to be one of the most unstable programs I have - it almost never runs for longer than a day, and often crashes within an hour. This is and has been true in various releases over the last 2 years, including the latest. It's a shame, because it's the best music library interface available - but I wish I could use something like sox or xmms to actually handle the playback.
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Great Work!
by Melon on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @13:35
The new Amarok release is looking excellent, and I really like that mockup! Great work- Amarok is one of the best apps I've ever used, and I'm sure it'll get even better with the 2.0 release.
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we didnt like it!!!!
by meh on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @15:08
Seriously, we didnt like it.

Lets see if the developers of amarok will be sensible enough to NOT go into this path...

And if its already changed, please do like when they tried to chaneg the browser position to horizontal (wtf) and they've reverted some versions back in the svn.... PLEASE, I beg ya

happy (until now) amarok user
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Plain brilliant.
by Debian User on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @15:33
Plain brilliant.

For the GUI I would say, looks lovely. I am glad to hear that Phonon works out so good for you already. Lets hope Amarokers will push the limit of Phonon-xine to what they had in Amarok-xine already, that would cover one of the backends already quite fine.

Also, reading this stuff, to me this reads like Amarok could kill DRM only shops by the way of making us get to know fairly traded music. That would be your even higher achievement. So yes, push ahead, get Windows versions out there, go to the masses and liberate them of those who hold them hostage with Britney Spears remakes.

Yours, Kay
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i DONT LIKE new GUI
by ref on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @16:41
What for i need "now playing" http://static.kdenews.org/content/the-road-to-kde-4/vol12_4x_amarok.png
at the center of the screen that occupies 70% of the screen?! Do you think users are so stupid that cannot understand that highlighted line in playlist is playing?!

Also why did you move buttons to the up left? Is it for mac users? Dont you think amarok is mostly linux player.

Users need to listen the music and not to "rediscover" how to disable unused features.
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broken web-page layout
by Per Bothner on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @16:57
Could somebody fix the layout of this page (and any similar pages) so it doesn't require a super-wide display? Right now a horizontal scrollbar appears when I narrow the Konqueror window to less than 1200 pixels, which is ridiculous! The main article body lines get truncated at about 1000 pixels. If I enlarge the font, it is even worse!
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Keep the old UI!
by Ben on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @17:54
Please keep the old UI! At least make it an option among different layout styles in user preferences.

This article puts forward the idea that Amarok merely copies the playlist style of XMMS/Winamp. That's true in the one-song-per-line sense, but Amarok goes beyond that by displaying way more information than the default XMMS/Winamp playlists ever did: Amarok gives you something more like a spreadsheet where you manipulate the widgets to get the playlist to display to your liking, including column order, sort order, and my favorite feature from recent releases, the highlighting of recently-added tracks. I LOVE that one. So I would say there's nothing "old" or "boring" or "due for change" in Amarok's playlist display. In fact, I think the current playlist format has quite a high information density, assuming all your music files have tag information.

As some others seemed be suggesting in not-so-many words, I agree that Amarok should be playlist-centric. I find three panes annoying, and they seem to stray from being playlist-centric. In the proposed layout, the amount of application real-estate the playlist takes up goes way down.
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True gapless playing
by Guillaume on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @19:47
As long as Amarok will not have a true gapless playing engine (as is available with the Crossfade plugin in XMMS), I will not be using it.

All the gizmos in Amarok are sure fine, but if it cannot do the most important thing - playing music and going track to trac without interruption, like is available on a CD player - then it's all for nothing,
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Fix tags before the new GUI, please
by Larry on Tuesday 13/Mar/2007, @22:45
It looks like there's a lot of commentary about the GUI. Well, count me on the "it's not broken, don't fix it" side. Really, I rarely if ever look at the GUI in Amarok. I interact with it using the media buttons on my keyboard. I *like* the iTunes-esque (not winamp-esque) interface.

If there's any GUI changes to make to Amarok, the article already points out what they are. For tag management, Juk currently blows Amarok away. I use Amarok as my player but still switch to Juk to do heavy duty refiling and updating. Simple things like the MusicBrainz integration in Juk are far better than Amarok's, which can waste time and lose data more often than not. Please, consider that a UI bug to fix before reinventing the interface.
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XBMC integration
by Timur on Wednesday 14/Mar/2007, @02:31
Would it be possible to have Amarok 2 integrated with XBMC?

I mean:

- controlling an XBOX MEDIA CENTER ala foxytunes
- streaming an MP3 to an XBMC

thanks,
Timur
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sound!
by Konstantin on Wednesday 14/Mar/2007, @02:57
amarok is very good player, exept one - the sound! it sounds ugly, even with equalizers! do better sounding, i dont know how, and it will be the best!
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Wishlist
by alterego on Wednesday 14/Mar/2007, @05:09
Are there any plans for a "real" plugin infrastructure, not just dcop calls? Maybe with language bindings for Ruby/Python/Whateva?
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I like !
by messner on Wednesday 14/Mar/2007, @08:52
I like amarok very much and this new version looks promising ;))

Keep up the good work ...
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Playlist Overhaul is Much Welcomed
by Kevin Dean on Wednesday 14/Mar/2007, @09:37
Like the quest for the "perfect" browser, I've long been seeking a powerful, flexible and consistant media player and organizer.

Having been told that Amarok is the best player around, I tried it, and fell in love with about 90% of it.

However, the single thing that made Amarok unusable for me was the "wonky" playlist setup. Creating a play list is simple enough, there's a few logical ways to do it. Where my issues come in with Amarok is that the player seems to believe when I click a song it should then be added to the playlist, rather than played in PLACE of the playlist.

This is so counter intuitive that I've pushed Amarok pretty far down on my list of "decent" players, instead resorting to Rhythmbox or (ug) Banshee.

Hopefully, with the rework of Amarok for KDE4, it will claim it's rightful place on my desktop. That is, if playlists make sense by then.
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Context Info Idea
by Justin Noel on Wednesday 14/Mar/2007, @11:16
First off, great work putting this stuff together in a semi-functional state so quickly. I love how it makes the context stand out and much more useful.

However, I always thought that the context would be most useful under the playlist, maybe with a 50/50 vertical layout. It would imply a very nice "Master/Details" relationship between them. It would also provide a nice fat area to display the context so one could fit a good album pic or lastfm style album collage. I usually have fairly short playlists and even if I have a long one, I'm only really conerned with the next 5 songs or so. Maybe some customization could be in order for window placement...

Granted, maybe I've just been working with too many database apps recently which have vertical master->detail relationships, but this screenshot is the first I've seen where the details are to the left of the master... usually for hoizontal layout it's to the right.

My $0.03,
Good work so far,
Thanks again,
--Justin
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New GUI vs Old GUI
by Fri13 on Wednesday 14/Mar/2007, @13:11
http://static.kdenews.org/content/the-road-to-kde-4/vol12_4x_amarok.png On this GUI, i think there is wrong direction.

User likes to search music what they have and add it to playlist. And then reads more info about artist or lyrics if s/he has time. Most time user just listen music and does other things same time.

That's why it should be easy to search music and add it to playlist and possible save them or add them to mediaplayer etc etc...

-On this new gui, user needs first search music from left side and then if using drag, drag it over whole application to right side panel to get it added.

-Position slider is still way too small and it should be more like kaffeine has, using whole space what can have.

-Playlist search bar should be more closer it and collection search bar

-I dont like to use that "graphic" list when something is playing and bars go up/down etc. I would suggest that if user takes it away, it will disapear. And it position could be much better.

-Play/Pause, Stop, next, etc. Buttons are on left upper corner when playlist is on right side and it most control buttons are under it. What about making playlist + action buttons more as player by moving play/stop... buttons to over playlist if you like to have three panel view?

-Playlist save, undo, redo etc, looks good

-It's nice that Collection and Information panel now can be seen together. That info panel should not take so much space, user likes to see own collection and have playlist infos like name, artist, album, time and someone likes have rating too.

-How about possibility to remove that status bar from down from taking space? Now there is info about playlist playtime and position slider.

-Volyme slider could be near play/stop... buttons and i would like to see theme about that too...

-More configuration options for user about panels, like usually KDE apps have. Right click > Edit toolbars etc... and option to move them...

Just my opinions... (ps. sorry about bad english)
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future of kde !!!
by djouallah mimoune on Wednesday 14/Mar/2007, @13:34
" Amarok on these platforms will single-handedly do more for awareness of KDE as a multi-OS development platform than any other application "

i am a happy guy now, i am less concerned about the future of kde project, if if gnome win, kde is always a very wonderful tool to make multi platform software.

it is really funy now to see that the only part of kde which is linux specific is kdebase/workspace

great keep the good job
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The new UI is awful
by Coward on Wednesday 14/Mar/2007, @17:30
The best approach is to take the nice things about the mock up gui and integrate them into the old ui or modify aspects of it. The particularly annoying feature is that to add specific songs from specific albums is a serious mouse moving and clicking exercise. What I would like is integration of a video manager whose collection can be maintained separately but whose contents can be added to any playlist with e.g music. Implementing this with the new phonon et al stuff is more than enough to justify a 2.0 however if you would like to go over the top you can add support for jack plugins whenever the underlying backends provide access to jack. Now you don't have to reinvent the wheel and you can actually produce a product that can be simple for the casual user, yet powerful with even per song or per album effects and filters. Come to thing of it I have not seen anything like it unless I run a menagerie of applications that require constant attention. Now tack on my linux-input-layer rf remote and my computer can do what no known affordable multimedia equipment dare tackle :)
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thanks
by R J on Thursday 15/Mar/2007, @21:57
Unfortantly no matter what those building this do, there will always be people who hate it, or like it. Frankly I don't care what it looks like as long as it plays my music.

Thanks for the work all do on amarok.
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Suggestions
by Git on Friday 16/Mar/2007, @03:49
I think, as other people said, that it may be good to focus on collection management.

I suggest to allow user to manage collection overriding tags. For example, I have a lot of single songs from different artists and albums on a directory that I call "various". So, I would like to have all those songs in the collection udner a "Various" section (I could edit all tags from those files ant put "Various" as artist, but I'll loose artis real information).

I also have a large directory with albums and songs that I haven't listened yet, or I want to examine with more detail until decide to keep them or drop. It would be nice to be able to tag all thos files (or just a directory) with a "testing" label or something like that. Sometimes I want to hear new music, and that directory is the best place, but I can't recognize those files in the collection view.

It may be useful to be able to treat albums as songs in, for example, aleatory playback o suggested playback. Amarok would suggest to the user a whole album, instead single songs. Sometimes I want to hear a complete album, without the dinamic changes that I feel when playlist is jumping over different songs and music styles.


And, of ocurse, a tag system for taggins songs and albums, wich could be used to generate user playlists.


Thanks for this great audio player (also video player soon), it's really outstanding.
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JuK
by Hannes Hauswedell on Saturday 17/Mar/2007, @06:26
what about juk?

will there be new versions? i don't need an online store, wikipedia stories, cover art, lyrics are any of that other stuff.

i just want a kde-media-player with good playlist handling and a powerul tag editor. the last versions of juk already sucked very much (the cover art stuff, broken engines, high memory usage...).
it seems juk has been completely neglected since the amarok hype :(
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Amarok 2.0 look
by Jeroi on Wednesday 28/Mar/2007, @00:50
I like a lot when it comes song controls. amaroks 1.* had controls below the playlist, but I am glad that they moves to top, as my eyes look controls always from top of the programs.

What I hope:

I use only the playlist. So I need configuration to amarok 2 that can hide those 2 panels on the left and middle. It is simple as this: I just listen music amarok hided. When I open it, I'll just change a song in 10 000 song playlist and add some priority to some songs and close amarok again to continue work.

What I dont like:

Mostly that the new look feels like WMP, thats why I used winamp in windows. Winamp offers just the playlist, with needed funcionality arround playlist.
This is more the reason why I dont like itunes. I dont like that information about song just explodes to my eyes when I open the program.
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Some people..
by Raven on Friday 20/Apr/2007, @23:59
Some people are so afraid of change it's scary.

I like then new look thus far.

It's interesting, unique, and fresh. My only suggestion would be to work on the playlist more...make it easier to navigate through. Just keep in mind, the playlist is very important, and users need to be able to use it and work with it simply. It also needs to be flexible.

I like the progression though. Good work.
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too cluttered
by axis on Sunday 27/May/2007, @05:17
IMO, it's too cluttered. 3 columns takes up way too much space. What I love about the current interface is that the one column to the left houses so many sections. So you have space for your playlist while still being given a ton of features. Look at how scrunched the playlist is (you can't even read the column names!) I like to have, title, artist, time, album and genre displayed, how would I fit all of this without it looking hideous? I know this is far from a final design, but it was posted in order to receive feedback, and I have to say I don't like it much.

But I trust the Amarok devs will come up with something inventive and user-friendly in the end, they are a great bunch.
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The new UI made me hesitate wether I would...
by Herwet on Sunday 15/Jul/2007, @14:13
choose Amarok or not. I want a simple overlook of my music where I in one glance can see title, artist, rating, genre and own comments on a list of songs. Not at one song at a time. It is the overlook that helps me like for example when I am in charge playing music at a party. I then need to see as many songs as possible in a simple list. Don´t have time to click on every other song when planing. I also need to be able to have a column with my own comments about like pace, good for dancing etc etc.

If I get the above and if Amarok comes for Windows, then it will be easier for me to change to Linux one day, which I for sure want to. I see no future in a monopolistic Windows.
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the new ui isn't good...
by adredz on Saturday 16/Feb/2008, @07:35
i don't like the mock up. the central pane is irrelevant. it only only degrades its usability...

keep it up!
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I love Amarok but.....
by andykriss on Wednesday 28/May/2008, @08:31
Amarok is sweet to use... but are u all afraid to really redesign the GUI??
i dont see much difference between the two.... all i see is just windows and tabs being re-arranged. if u going to make remake Amarok why not make a new and easy to use GUI.. that would be great and it would compliment KDE4
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