In this week's KDE Commit-Digest: A whole set of bugfixes and feature additions in Plasma, and various optimisations across KDE. Usability improvements in Blinken. More work on the timeline tool, including fuzzy selection in Digikam. Support for XComposite translucency in the Konsole KPart. QtScript can now deal transparently with all scripting backends supported by Kross. Improvements in KWin Composite effects. Support for an old feature request, "parenthesis highlighting as an expression" in Kate. Continued interface work in the KHotNewStuff2 library. Progress in the Bonjour protocol implementation in Kopete. Support for stroke gradients, and adding and removing rows, columns and cells in the new Table Flake shape in KOffice. Initial import of kio-giobridge, a bridge interface between the KDE and GNOME I/O methods. Work is resumed on the CIA Plasma applet. A Luna Plasmoid (moon phase display) is added to KDE SVN. Dragon Player (formerly Codeine) is moved from playground/multimedia to kdereview, with a view to moving into kdemultimedia for KDE 4.1. The KDE 4 version of Yakuake, essentially a rewrite, is imported into KDE SVN. Read the rest of the Digest here.
Comments
>> First of all, there is no reason to rewrite anything.
>
> I think he didn't mean to use the word "rewrite", i.e. replacing an existing
> implementation with a new one, I am quite certain he meant "from ground up",
> i.e. starting to implement a second stack starting at the wire level.
Yes, thats right.
> And GIO is "Desktop independent"?
>
> Again I think this is just unfortunate wording. In this context it more likely
> means "not linking against any GUI library", e.g. an implementation just linking
> with QtCore would also be "Desktop independent".
Yes, exactly. It's not possible use KIO and it's protocol handlers without installing and running some KDE specific stuff at the moment. Perhaps that's all more on the edges of KIO, but it makes it less attractive for using it cross desktop.
> And "why not" throw out something that works pretty well for a new toy, just because GNOME is being NIH again?
I don't think it's fair to call it a "toy". They have implemented something that from design comes very close to what has been discussed since many years ("D-VFS", "Common-VFS", "Shared-VFS",...). Unfortunately it was not there before KDE4 development started.
> Because you would need the core KIO infrastructure for things like kio_http,
> kio_imap4, etc.
Sure, but they are kind of in a different domain (used internally by certain KDE applications).
I agree that what i'm proposing looks a bit weird, it's just that i don't know of a better pragmatic solution.
> Why is it overlapping? Parts of the functionality in KIO (particularly
> network transparent file-management like smb, ftp, sftp, webdav) would be
> delegated to GIO/GVFS. That's just putting the KIO interface on top of a
> shared implementation.
You seem to be saying instead of maintaining a single well tested code base, we'd now need to maintain two of them. One of which is unproven, and only covers part of the problem space. I don't see this as a winning argument.
>> That's just putting the KIO interface on top of a
>> shared implementation.
>
> You seem to be saying instead of maintaining a single well tested code base,
> we'd now need to maintain two of them. One of which is unproven, and only covers
> part of the problem space. I don't see this as a winning argument.
First, i would always rate usability higher than maintainability. But i'm pretty sure that moving towards a shared implementation, even if it's only for the VFS parts of KIO, will in the long run reduce maintenance "cost" as well.
However, as things are evolutionary, lets just try with an optional plugin and see if users like it. It's far too early to discuss maintenance cost or whether GVFS should really replace certain parts of KIO by default.
Software development is 90% maintenance.
And what about shell access? Legacy apps? Well, the fact is that KDE should use FUSE as its KIO backend, and be the "weight behind" to get FUSE ported to platforms where it's not present or not fully implemented. This way if there's KIO, GIO or whatever else *IO, it's not that relevant, everyone could be happy and work better (I would do, at least :-)
I know this is armchair programming but that's the direction I would like to see for the *nix desktop experience
Seems to me that the only proper way to implement network filesystems is in the actual filesystem layer, underneath both gnome *and* kde.
Dragon Player seems OK, but my multimedia solution in KDE 3 is Kaffeine. It's an amazing app, playing CDs, VCDs, DVDs, Video, a useable Konqueror plugin, etc. Will it be ported to KDE 4?
kaffeine4 does exist in svn however, at the moment, it lacks features present in the kde3 version. I'm sure that will change over time.
Kaffeine is my no.1 Multimedia Player and Amarok for mp3, streams etc.
I also miss Kaffeine as a KDE4 app but I use the KDE 3.5x version on KDE4 for DVDs, CDs etc. in the meantime and Smplayer (which looks nice but can't match Kaffeine) for video files. I wasn't so impressed by Dragon Player.
I hope to have a full-featured kaffeine4 soon.
Same here. I like Kaffeine. And I want it on KDE 4.
Dragon Player is being the ultra-lightweight video app, making it ideal for embedding in Konqueror etc. No doubt Kaffeine will be ported and continue to have all the functionality you want.
I also dig Smplayer.
http://smplayer.sourceforge.net/
"I also dig Smplayer."
I was going to say that... it acts amazingly 'smart', resuming playback from the position you left off etc.
well, that was actually the defining feature of codeine (predecessor of dragonplayer): keeping state.
I found quotation from unknown source and author: "Yes, we have started. Kaffeine4 will use Phonon, unfortunately Phonon does not yet implement all features needed by Kaffeine, so do not expect a kde4 version of Kaffeine until at least kde 4.1"
Source of quotation: http://hftom.free.fr/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=18
As a simple UI for playing videos fast, dragon player is the best and is a must
addition to kdemultimedia. We also need a full-fledged, feature rich, easy to
use player for which kplayer seems to be the best choice. Unfortunately it is
not as popular as kaffeine, but it works much better, particularly the way it handles removable media is excellent. Looking forward to kplayer being ported...
Hello! Where can I find videos of the KDE Release Event (keynote,etc.)? Thanks!
We will announce the release event videos at the Dot (this website) when they are available.
It might take a few days to process them.
Danny
How great KWin is!! The integration of compositing and window management is a huge improvement, it makes you think why in the beginning there were 2. I can't stop showing my friends how cool is to toggle compositing in KWin, often without even noticing a flicker!
I was skeptical when I first heard about that, but now I foresight a successfull future (an present!) for KWin. Thanks Lubos !!!
I'd like to see a start-up wizard for the first time you use KDE 4 with a new profile. I believe SUSE had one for a while. There was an older version of SUSE I installed, that when I first used it, it prompted me to configure KDE through a wizard.
It asked me if I want to use single clicks or double-clicks to launch apps. It asked me if I wanted to mimic OS X, XP, or use KDE defaults, etc. With QT including a Clearlooks engine, you could even configure KDE to mimic Gnome to a certain extent. I sure wouldn't want to, but there are plenty of people (for whatever reason) that like Gnome. It might help people consider trying it out, and eventually switching.
A start-up wizard helping you configure KDE might go a long way to help ease some of the complaints of people not being able to configure KDE 4, not to mention help ease the transition of potential new users we might get from the Mac, Windows and Gnome crowds. KDE 4 is new and shiny, and we have to expect that new users are going to want to try it out.
This no doubt would require that KDE bundle some themes that mimic the above systems, but I'm sure there will be plenty of them on kde-look.org
There is a Plasma applet which is currently doing nothing but the plan is to make it something like KPersonalizer (That first time wizard).
Thanks! Good to know!
Hi
Could someone please point me to the release schedules for 4.1 ? Next Kubuntu will offer KDE 4. I wonder if it will be the KDE 4.0 or KDE 4.1 branch, and whether there is a chance of one more KDE release before April.
Thanks a lot, and THANK YOU for the awsome work !
Tentative schedule is for 4.1 in July 2008.
John.
...so Hardy will have KDE 4.0 as an option.
Many thanks guys! Any chance of a point release, say KDE 4.0.1 ? Would that just be bug/security fixes ? Or, in other words, has the development jumped mainly to the 4.1 branch or is it still in KDE 4.0.x ?
Ok, I found some info. There will be at least one point, maybe two point releases I guess before Kubuntu freeze:
http://techbase.kde.org/index.php?title=Schedules/KDE4/4.0_Release_Sched...
As per features, it looks like there are lots of features still coming in the 4.0 branch, I would expect they will be released in the point releases:
http://developer.kde.org/development-versions/kde-4.0-features.html
Thanks!
"As per features, it looks like there are lots of features still coming in the 4.0 branch, I would expect they will be released in the point releases:
http://developer.kde.org/development-versions/kde-4.0-features.html"
That's old, and represented the goals intended to be done in time for 4.0.0. The 4.0.x branch is basically feature-frozen, although there are some rumblings about slipping some configurability into the Plasma panel somehow.
That's exactly the kind of info I was looking for. Thanks a lot! It looks like I'll switch to KDE 4 by the time Kubuntu 8.10 is released (two releases ahead). Cheers!
By the way, I just tried kde4-core in hardy, in a separate partition ... there is a lot of unpolished stuff, it really shows it's a first version of KDE-4, and an alpha version of kubuntu ;-). But KDE-4 is looking really, really exciting ! Kudos to everyone involved!
Well if 4.1 won't be ready by the next Kubuntu release...
(I hope the Kubuntu folks are actively working on KDE 4.0 and not treating it like a second class citizen like they have been the KDE branch of Ubuntu in the past...)
There is always openSUSE, which I think might actually make the the 4.1 release..
We'll see.. We have a couple interesting months ahead..
As you're bringing other distros on the plate, let me do the same: Fedora 9 will ship with KDE 4.0 (as the default and only KDE; from KDE 3, we're shipping only compatibility libraries (kdelibs3, kdebase3) and modules not available in 4.0 (kdepim(*), kdewebdev(**), kdevelop)).
The plan (subject to change) is to push KDE 4.1 as an update once it will be available. (This has been done before, Fedora Core 4 was upgraded from 3.4 to 3.5 in updates.)
(*) enterprise branch, KitchenSync from OpenSync0.30API branch
(**) I know kdewebdev is technically available in 4.0, but it's missing its main application (Quanta), so shipping kdewebdev 4.0 wouldn't be very useful.
> Note that current XRender implementations (in X/drivers) often perform rather poorly and therefore the OpenGL mode should usually have much better performance.
How poorly they are can be for example seen here:
http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=106338
At the moment, buying a new nvidia card will only decrease your performance. If a new one is needed, you will go best with an used AGP card.
That mean we will see a new release soon? I thought there won't be any untill beginning February (4.0.1).
Right - the next bugfix release (4.0.1) is scheduled for February. That will be our next release.
Danny
Hi.
Is there a kioslave documentation page somewhere? A howto or something that will get me started writing one, or perhaps discourage me from trying. I've googled for it but can't seem to find anything appropriate.
http://techbase.kde.org/index.php?title=Development/Architecture/KDE3/Ne...
I really like KDE 4, and I use it as my main desktop now. However, one little bug frustrates me a lot. I can't really copy files over samba. I already created a bugreport for it (https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=154929), but so far, nobody confirmed this bug, which lends me to believe it might have something to do with my configuration / the kubuntu packages. I'm wondering if anybody here can confirm this bug. I'm stuck using the command line smbget to download stuff over samba, which ain't that convenient.
I would like to add that on kde3 , this issue doesn't exist.
I would like to add that on kde3 , this issue doesn't exist.
Yes, looks like they just removed some good old friends in KDE4.
This is why (together with speed that sucks in my machine) I keep using 3.5, and will continue to do so until a really stable version comes out or 4.1.
And after I buy a new computer!!
Sadly, this should talk per-se about KDE4 current state in my experience :-(
Well, the samba kio slave is there, but after a couple of seconds of copying, it starts to stall, and draw a very high cpu load. Were you able to reproduce this bug btw, or don't you have a 4.0 installation of KDE?
But this is actually one of the few remaining things that frustrate me a bit. On my machine most of KDE 4 actually runs faster then KDE 3. (athlon XP 2500+, 512 MB ram, old Geforce 2 videocard) Applications start significantly faster, the DE environment starts faster, and most things feel more responsive in general. Only downside is that it uses more RAM than KDE 3, but still not too much for my moderate 512 MB (due to double buffering), and scrolling in most applications draws a higher cpu load.
I have a Duron 1.6Ghz with 512 RAM and a GeForce4.
I found some things really faster, but dolphin and moving plasma applets is really a pain in the ass.
Other day I wanted to move a icon in the desktop and the whole desktop (including all icons, desktop, plasmoids) moved! Very funny, but not good ;)
..and funny too: they made the M$N butterfly more evelish:
http://commit-digest.org/issues/2008-01-13/moreinfo/758135/#visual
And good to see the pace of improvement everyone is putting up.. KDE rules! My panel is back too! Watching svn up never has been so much fun ;)
Maybe slightly irrelevant and the wrong place to ask, but heck, I'll do it anyway. : )
I've just installed KDE 4.0 and it has been, despite its flaws, been fun using it.
However, I'm somewhat disappointed by the lack of documentation for Plasma. I know there's a how-to-build-your-first-plasmoid-in-c++ tutorial at Techbase, but there aren't any that show you how to make one in e.g. JavaScript. That's something I've been looking forward to do. Apparently, there's support for scripting Plasmoids in JavaScript, but I can't find any documentation for it, nor any good examples (there are some JavaScript examples in playground, I know, but they wouldn't run here). Can anyone tell if there are any plans of doing this in the near future?
yeah, it's just been a rediculously crazy past few months. comprehensive docs are already on the 4.1 roadmap for plasma. i appreciate your patience in the meantime. =)