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  KDE on Windows?
KDE on Unix and other platforms Posted by Dre on Thursday 17/May/2001, @12:14
from the is-more-better dept.
I was browsing SourceForge today and stumbled across the KDE on Cygwin project. Apparently, they have ported Qt 2.3.0 for X11, Qt 1.45 and KDE 1.1.2 to use the CygWin tools and CygWin/XFree86, respectively ports of the popular GNU platform and XFree86 to Windows. Although this is a big step towards making KDE applications useable on Windows machines, it might be interesting to get rid of the X server requirements as Simon Haussman has done with Konqueror/Embedded. It seems to me that a free desktop infrastructure of KDE's caliber that runs on both Windows and UNIX, and perhaps even embedded devices runing Qt/Embedded, would increase the number and quality of KDE programs, and open the door to KDE for many more users. What do you think?


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Over 40 comments listed. Printing out index only.
Trolltech?
by AC on Thursday 17/May/2001, @13:07
I suppose that Trolltech would not like the X11 version of Qt ported to Windows, since they have a non-free Windows version already.

This could get rid of one of their ways to make $$$.

It would be nice to see KDE running on Windows though. I think Gtk already has a free Windows version, so...
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Re: KDE on Windows?
by Diedrich Vorberg on Thursday 17/May/2001, @13:10
II believe it is generally a good idea to make Free Software attractive for daily use for a the largest possible number of people possible. KDE is doing so by making free Unix environments accessible for people whoes computer expriences are largely GUI/Windows based. Porting KDE to Windows is a logical step in that directon,
enabling people to have a gentle transition from the platform they grew up with (and of which they are told, it is the only one in existance) to the better alternative. Also it is a great thing to make Konqueror available on this platform as an alternative browser that
*does* enforce standarts! So I think this is a good thing!

However I believe it is important not to copy Windows on Linux or create an alternative Windows on Windows. There must be no doubt a
completely Free system is the better system!
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Re: KDE on Windows?
by Joe Theriault on Thursday 17/May/2001, @13:14
I'd been thinking for a while that this would be a Good Thing, but in particular having KDE on Windows so that KOffice could be there as well, because I think a lot of Windows users would be receptive to an office suite that doesn't cost a lot (MS, Corel) and doesn't suck (Staroffice). This project (if brought more up to date, and marketed to some degree) could be used to ween Windows users from the interface they know, and gain KDE more attention.

Kudos to the project.
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Re: KDE on Windows?
by Fabi on Thursday 17/May/2001, @13:16
Although a nice attempt, I think it is mainly a proof of concept. Which windows-user would mess around with installing this? One who is really interessted would give linux a try, and the others wouldn't mind.
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Konqueror/Embedded
by Pyretic on Thursday 17/May/2001, @13:42
btw konq/e is doing quite well. I really like this small browser. Go try the latest snapshot (you don't need anything special for it): http://devel-home.kde.org/~hausmann/snapshots/

faq is here:
http://www.konqueror.org/embedded.html
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The apps, not the enviroment
by Karl Garrison on Thursday 17/May/2001, @14:41
I doubt many Windows users have a desire to use KDE's window manager or the like, but might enjoy a few of the apps, like Kmail, Knode, and some of the games.

As much as I enjoy using Konqueror under Linux, I think there would be little motiviation to use it instead of IE on a Windows machine that has IE built-in.


-Karl
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Re: KDE on Windows?
by Hi on Thursday 17/May/2001, @15:15
This is a good idea but it has to be done systematically, by creating some X-independent layer including system independent IPC and window manager layer. KDE for Windows will always be a toy, but I would like to see a framebuffer-based KDE.
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Re: KDE on Windows?
by Björn Svensson on Friday 18/May/2001, @00:26
I think KDE should avoid windows, otherwise we'll just end up with a Mozilla-like "port to all platform"-hell... Spare us!
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Native Win32 would be rather easy...
by Mosfet on Friday 18/May/2001, @14:46
If you look at the sources of Qt, *very* little of it is dependent on Xlib. Once you port QWidget, QPixmap, QFont, and QFontMetrics, virtually everything else is derived from that. 99% of the work will be in those 4 classes. Xlib is used in very little of Qt itself (for obvious reasons since Qt sells a native Windows lib). You can tell TrollTech was very careful to minimize the platform dependent code, because they want to sell the Windows version. Porting the GPL version to Win32 should not be a massive effort, since it's the same sources used in the professional version, just with the Win32 code missing.

There are other classes that would require some work like the sound and network I/O classes, but KDE doesn't use these AFAIK.

KDE is also a lot less X dependent than you'd think (which is why we also have Konq/Embedded ;-) While KWin and KDesktop doesn't make sense on Windows, getting the rest of kdelibs running natively on Windows should also be straightforward with a good Posix compiler.
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Re: KDE on Windows?
by [Bad-Knees] on Friday 18/May/2001, @16:02
I couldent care less, im not using windoze.
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Re: KDE on Windows?
by Edward Rataj on Saturday 19/May/2001, @06:00
Somehow I get the idea that we are loosing sight of the forest. If we have a killer GUI like KDE and a killer app like KOffice (needs improvement), people will flock to Linux, KDE, etc. The hell with windows. Let's make KDE, KOffice (Open Office?) the best, fastest and most elegant. We're almost there. I for one, need an AutoCAD equivalent for Linux. LinuxCAD is crap and Qcad is not there yet.
I love what's been done so far. Thanks to everyone involved for Letting me use a great GUI.

Ed
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Re: KDE on Windows?
by KiwiGuy on Saturday 19/May/2001, @11:43
I'd *really love* to see this happen! As I see it, this was almost bound to happen sooner or later! And the more KDE there is out there (whatever the platform) , the better! Anyway - just my 2c worth ... :-) . To the KDE team - keep up the good work - KDE *rocks* !
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Re: KDE on Windows?
by Vlad on Sunday 20/May/2001, @09:14
Better yet, implement qt in the hardware. Windows GDI already enjoys that privelege -- so why not do the same with a much more powerful toolkit like QT?
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Re: KDE on Windows?
by Con Kolivas on Sunday 20/May/2001, @14:46
Why on earth would you waste your time? Windows is windows because of IT'S windows. Rip the guts out of it, remove functionality and (dare I say it) stability and noone would want to install kde. The only people who would want it are those who use kde on linux, bsd etc. so you'd be aiming at an even smaller audience than now, which would consist of people already using the product anyway. Concentrate your efforts where it counts.
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Re: KDE on Windows?
by eva on Monday 21/May/2001, @03:16
kdelibs would be nice to have on windows, because then you can code portable apps not only based on QT but also on the very smooth KDE interface.
This will especially help industry that want to port their apps to linux, but need to continue parallel development on windows. An even better thing would be a wrapper to the MFC event loop so that you can use both events loops in one program for porting big apps in small steps.

I think there are a lot of developers out there in the industry who'd love to make a linux version or their products, but who cannot persuade their business people to throw away their code and start over from the beginning. If KDE helps the people to make an easy transition from MFC to QT/KDE this will result on a lot of applications being available for Linux/KDE!
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Re: KDE on Windows?
by Gary on Monday 21/May/2001, @03:33
How would you implement the blue screen of death in KDE. :)
Really, with having to reboot that unstable opperating system all the time, why would you want to give KDE this reputation ??

Gary
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I want KDE on BeOS
by XRay on Monday 21/May/2001, @11:45
I don't realy care about a Win32-version. But a BeOS version of some KDE apps (like KOffice) would be cool. According to this article (see the link below), there are already people working on it:

http://www.benews.com/story/4007
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KDE on MacOSX?
by Stentapp on Monday 21/May/2001, @13:32
Check out this link. We will soon have Qt for Macintosh, and maybe we can have KDE for MacOSX then!

http://www.trolltech.com/company/announce/mac.html
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Re: KDE on Windows?
by DjCoke on Tuesday 22/May/2001, @02:25
I'll think this would be a great idea to put kde on Windows boxes !
Then users under windows could personize the entire desktop.

And this is for kde the great way to expanse and have more users.
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Re: KDE on Windows?
by Angel Mendez on Tuesday 22/May/2001, @08:22
I think it should be done- Introduce Windows users
to the glory of The Linux/Unix way of thinking. Expand their minds. Challenge assumptions. That way, when the Microsoft empire falls, There will
be users who are primed and ready to switch to Unix/Linux. Yes, I know, the Gui is not the OS,
as in Windows (and should never be! Thank God) But, it's a step to more widepread acceptance without having to turn into Windows.

amadeus@asn.com
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Re: KDE on Windows?
by Andy Rondeau on Thursday 28/Jun/2001, @02:47
Some of the responses here show that some of the readers are rather unfamiliar with Windows.

Let's explain the 3 main areas of concern here:
Kernal
Shell / Window manager
Browser

People have this nasty habit of saying that Windows is a cancer by Billy that is unstable. That is true of the 9x/ME kernal, which is a hack of DOS. The NT kernal, used in NT/2000/XP is about as stable as Linux. In some situations, yes, it is unstable, in others, it's more stable then Linux. (Chances are, if it crashes a lot, it's a sign of bad hardware and not a buggy kernal.)

Windows default "window manager" and browser are explorer. IE (internet explorer) isn't integrated into windows, it's integrated into explorer. In fact, it's just as integrated as KDE's web browser is integrated into KDE!

(Thus, if you want to get rid of IE, you'll need to replace explorer alltogether)

If you replace explorer with KDE, what do you gain? As far as stability, a lot, because you're replacing the weakest link of windows. You also get a 100% replacement shell, which none of the current replacement shells can do. They all still use explorer to browse files! As far as usability, you don't gain much. KDE has a steeper learning curve then explorer, IMO, thus novice users might be even more intimidated. Expert users will probably like it better.

What do you need to get KDE to replace explorer/IE?
- You need to get the port of XFree to "mix" its onscreen windows with the windows on windows's desktop.
- You need to get KDE to integrate windows from windows into its taskbar.
- You need to create replacements for the explorer executables that wrap into KDE.
- You will probably need cygwin or equivilent

Doing so will allow for full KDE integration and will actually make WindowsNT even more stable.
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would it be more stable then the current windows?
by dan sawvel on Thursday 11/Oct/2001, @09:46
i'm a newbie when it come to linux, in fact i have little to none experiance with unix or linux. i, like many other windows users, am fed up with the MS OS. it's unreliable, unstable, and uncooperative when it comes to changing it to your liking. i also grew up on windows and am stuck on using thier OS for the time being, and i'm sick of not have the control and stability of my own computer. the idea of having a desktop other then the MS desktop is a great idea. it would allow normal user in the same predicament as me to warm up to linux or Unix software. however, the idea of piggy backing on the MS OS rasies questions on the stability. will it work better then the windows currently on the majority of computer that use MS?
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Going in for the test... heh
by Rich Kreider on Wednesday 17/Oct/2001, @05:02
Well...

I have KDE running on Windows right now with cygwin and xfree86.

XWin.jpg
WindowsKDE.jpg
WindowsKDE2.jpg
WindowsKDE3.jpg


What I'm going to attempt now, is to replace the shell=explorer.exe and see if I can just load up cygwin.

Well, the reason, is because when I load it, and then load KDE, it's soooo slow.

It reminds me of a couple years back, when I was running Win98 on 8mb ram. Heh. Slow. But now I have 228MB ram, 333mhz AMDk6-2 Lemme see if I can get this too work. If not, oh well. :) I'm running windows 2000 professional btw. :)
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h3ll ripping explore.exe out and slipping KDE in..
by Dr_Blackross on Wednesday 09/Jan/2002, @23:03
as a shell would be nice.... i get sick of looking at the same old windows... and functions.

i usually replace explore with LiteStep from LiteStep.net but the themes from there usually crash due to a step.rc error or missing dll that u cant find anywhere handy.

it would be a good idea for KDE to come up with a shell replacement for windows machines or post a clear HOW-TO on the ways and means.
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i need installer?
by Camilo Lozano III on Monday 03/Feb/2003, @02:38
i'm looking for an installer for KDE and GNOME on Windows(CYGWIN) which is only one file so that when i will download it, it's only one file. i'm tired downloading many files. is there a site for KDE and GNOME that is already in zip, gzip, rar, ace, tar, bzip, or any archives(all files in compress). can anybody tell me where i can download it...

that's all, thanks!

cygwin user, CamiloX
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KDE as an explorer replacement
by Mat on Wednesday 24/Sep/2003, @01:58
I can see why you wouldn't want to waste time make windows look like linux but look at it this way:

I currently use a windows desktop simply to run programs like dreamweaver and photoshop for my work. There just simply isn't a way for me to switch completely to linux with these dependencies. I also use a linux computer that doubles as a home server. I love my kde desktop and I would love to have that environment on my windows machine. It wouldn't change the fact that I'm using windows but it would sure make life a little more interesting. I would like to agree with a previous comment that started out with "Some of the responses here show that some of the readers are rather unfamiliar with Windows." Porting kde and it's applications to windows would make life better for us that have to use windows everyday until big software companies understand and create versions of their software for linux. It would be very interesting to know why Macromedia and Adobe are holding off, you would think that it would be very simple for them to take ther macosX versions and build them for linux?

As for the benefits of cygwin... my life is now complete... no more typing 'ls' and 'rm' in a windows command prompt with the response of "comamnd not found" chmod and chown even work! I set c:\cygwin\bin as a search path and my windows already feels unixy, now only if I had a unixy gui......
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poo? YES
by Mr_boots on Friday 02/Jan/2004, @14:32
Apparently I have pooed my pants
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And not to forget...
by AcidHorse on Thursday 29/Jan/2004, @08:40
We can not forget the uninterruptable sleep processes and those damn zombie processes....
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Konsole
by Steve on Friday 23/Apr/2004, @17:39
Has anybody tried to use Kde's KONSOLE on windows. I'm dammned to use a win2k at my office and i do not even have the root for my desktop.
I'd love to use this terminal on windows. will it work with cygwin or it must be recompiled????
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kde on windows, great business sense
by mtntoprebel on Monday 19/Jul/2004, @16:03
the microslop world is based on greed and power, and the mergence of GNU over to that OS chops away at the financial power base that feeds the monster. Keep it up... the addition of each new program weakens the profit margin for MS!
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Great for apps
by Harrison TS on Monday 13/Jun/2005, @20:36
I think this is a great idea. It opens the door to KDE and GNU software for people who have used Windows all their life (which was me up until very recently). Also for me, I can now use the free KDE apps on my Windows machine. I hope they get the simple installer, though, because the long installation process is discouraging.
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KDE under windows
by treehel on Thursday 08/Dec/2005, @22:12
Yesterday i had an insight, that i can install KDE under windows and run both win32 and posix applications under one desktop. It would be an easy installation

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\Winlogon]
"Shell"="Explorer.exe"

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\Winlogon]
"Shell"="cygwin.exe"

but, it would be a very-long optimisation. For WIndows and for Cyrillic)))
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One can hope
by Abic Shadar on Wednesday 06/Sep/2006, @08:22
I personally agree, though at heart i like the world of free ware and share ware (for more then just bein chaeper) i've found several problems in coparate software not in others, and oddly enough the freeware seams to work better in most cases perhaps just luck there. But KDE for windows, if only you could get microsoft to endorse it as a standard, but you know MS, the most i can see it getting thought i hope i'm wrong is availiable, hard to find, and only those who habitually use linux will even seek it out, and thus no increase in apps for it. But to get kde working on unix and its children (including mac) and on windows, and some how make it a standard would excellent, though from a corprate stand point and competetion it would be impractical and less profitable for them to do. Becuase they thrive off of proprietary software, and i just now realized that the post i'm replying to is 5 years old, but I still don't see it happening thought i wish it would, cause kde is much better then the windows shell
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KDE on Windows
by Frank Green on Tuesday 25/Sep/2007, @06:44
I think this would be an excellent idea i go back and forth between windows and linux all of the time and i think kde is excellent and i would love to see it on windows it would beat looking at that dull start button and start bar all of the time
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