KDE Commit-Digest for 7th September 2008

In this week's KDE Commit-Digest: A KPhotoAlbum developer sprint leads to various developments, including a new viewer and support for image "stacks". Initial lyrics support and a new "Albums" applet in Amarok 2.0. Support for export to OpenDocument text and HTML formats for certain file types in Okular. More functionality in the Plasma "Engine Explorer", an application for data engine development. More work on the "grouping taskbar" and "Weather" applet for Plasma, and new features in the wallpaper configuration dialog. A new Plasma wallpaper plugin, "Mandelbrot fractal viewer" based on Eigen. Lots of new settings across KWin-Composite effects. Start of code for a "Plasma loader" in Raptor. Experiments with using Jabber to propose/find network games in KSirK. Support for subprojects with CMake, and a generic "Source Formatter" plugin (with multiple backends) in KDevelop 4. Start of an OpenSync plugin for Akonadi. An Akonadi "server configuration" KControl module, intended for use in KDE System Settings. Support for adding files through command-line arguments in Ark. "Instant search" is implemented in KCharSelect. More work on a new IRC implementation, and improved Kiosk support in Kopete. NEPOMUK query service, and kosdwidget move to kdereview. Import of "LokaRest", an experimental framework to access RESTful web services. A new application, kReMail, is added to playground/pim. Import of "deKorator" KWin window decoration engine to playground/artwork, and a KDE4 port of Kvkbd into playground/utils. KColorEdit 2.0 is released. Read the rest of the Digest here.


Is there plans for a firefox's noscript addon for konqueror?

I know that konq have the option for create a "white list", but i think is no easy. For example, With noscript i knew that is necessary to watch videos. And only with one click. But with konq, you can't know that althought you take a look the html code or let the whole page load the scripts.


PD: thanks for the digest

By Metoo at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

Thanks Danny, a joyfull read as usual :P

By Shuss at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

i am using kde4.1.64 and for the desktop i use the folderview activity, i have nothing against desktop activity except the fact i can't rename icons, and i don't like ( visually) putting the folderview applet on my desktop.
my questions is there a way to change the folder of the foldervoew activity( by default it is /home/myhome ?
any plan to add arrange icons vertically or horizontally ?
or better any plan to make applet icons smarter, ( rename, copy etc ...)

thanks for your work

By mimoune djouallah at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

> is there a way to change the folder of the foldervoew activity

just the other day i added a generic Configure Activity to the cashew, so now you can get to the desktop configuration dialog. from there we'll be adding a way to configure the plugin itself.

> plan to add arrange icons vertically or horizontally

you mean grid, etc. alignments? yes, it's on the TODO.

> any plan to make applet icons smarter, ( rename, copy etc ...)

also on the TODO, not sure how much time i'll personally have for this before 4.2 though. i'm already pretty full up.

By Aaron Seigo at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

> except the fact i can't rename icons,

I can't either (using trunk), but since the "Rename" menu item already is there, it's probably only a matter of time till it gets implanted.

> and i don't like ( visually) putting the folderview applet on my desktop.

Then use folderview as your desktop (containment). Coming in 4.2 if it isn't already available.

> my questions is there a way to change the folder of the foldervoew activity( by default it is /home/myhome ?

If it's the folderview applet, you configure it the same way as the other applets: press on the wrench in the hover menu.
Unfortunately I don't know how to enter the configuration dialog for the containment.

> any plan to add arrange icons vertically or horizontally ?

I think the plan is to save the icon positions. Not sure about it, though.

> or better any plan to make applet icons smarter, ( rename, copy etc ...)

Already in trunk (although, as I mentioned, rename doesn't work correctly for me at the moment).

By Hans Chen at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

"Then use folderview as your desktop (containment). Coming in 4.2 if it isn't already available."

It's availale in 4.2 Devel. I actually tried it but had a very unpleasant surprise after trying to switch back to the normal desktop.
This option was nowhere to be found. I had to go to the .kde4 folder and changed the containment plugin from folderview to desktop. I am sure that this will change though since KDE 4.2 isn't even alpha yet. Until then Newbies should avoid using this option ;)

By Bobby at Thu, 2008/09/18 - 5:00am

thanks really just one week and my wishes are here, thanks plasma dev

By mimoune djouallah at Sat, 2008/09/20 - 5:00am

Is the Mac OS like-menu plasmoid going to be ready for 4.2?

By LP at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

Yeah, id like to see this much missed KDE3 feature come back in KDE4(.2?)

By Ljubomir at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

It will only if anyone fixes the issues with it. I have talked to Friedrich Kossebau who started it (in playground/base) and he meant that there are serious problems which he is not capable of fixing (and the other developers he asked seem to not be capable, either).

By Stefan Majewsky at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

Capable as in time to care ;) In theory it should be easily portable, using the old trick from KDE3 with making the KMenuBar toplevel and then embedding the window in the plasmoid. I once had it half working, KMenuBar and friends even have all the code still active.

Problem: You will have a clash of the normal Qt style with the Plasma one, once the menu is embedded. I heard someone is working on a solution which will take the menu data, freedesktop-styled also from GTK apps, and make a menu itself, such being able to use the Plasma style. No idea how far this is.

By Frinring at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

What about the X-Topbar (or whatever it is called) from the Bespin style? It seems to work to work quite well (of course not for Non-kde-apps), it just could do with a few configuration options.
I don't know what plans Thomas has got for it, maybe it could be made into a plasmoid independently from Bespin (which is a really cool style, just seems not to be as stable as Oxygen is).


By Alex at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

Yes, it was Thomas, now I remember. For those curious about Bespin, see here:

By Frinring at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

It's not been touched in 4 and a half months, so I wouldn't bet on it:

Unfortunately, Friedrich has his hands full with Okteta. Any developers who are waiting in the wings: if you want this feature, it looks like you'll have to step up and help out, as the KDE guys are short-staffed :/

By anon at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

Those extenders look pretty cool. One thing I think that is slightly wrong with them, and would make them look even better is the fact that they are detached from the panel.

Instead of rendering them as a separate window like this:

| |
| |
| |
,---------------| |--------.
| `----------' |
| |

It should be rendered attached to the panel like this:

| |
| |
| |
,---------------' `--------.
| |
| |

That will probably require new functions in the theme engine and some code to snap the window to the top of the panel, but I think it would be worth the effort.

Hmmm HTML is disabled for some reason so no shiny ASCII art :-(

By Tim at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

Use non break spaces :

                |          |
                |          |
                |          |
,---------------|          |--------.
|               `----------'        |
|                                   |

                |          |
                |          |
                |          |
,---------------'          `--------.
|                                   |
|                                   |

By Shift at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

Ah cool. Still didn't quite work with my font though. How do you input nbsps without   or copy/paste lots? Is there an Alt-Gr shortcut?

Speaking of which, the alt-gr shortcuts for things like ←↓→↑, ×÷¹²³€½¾ and so on are one of the things I miss massively on windows. Does anyone make keyboards/stickers that have all the symbols on them?

By Tim at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

I used the compose key (Windows key) : Compose, Space, Space

The funny thing is that few days ago I have updated the wikipedia page to add this shorcut :)

I used this shorcut one time. After, I copy/paste the non breaking space.

By Shift at Sun, 2008/09/14 - 5:00am

i sent an email about a month ago or so mentioning we'll want to eventually extend Plasma::PanelSvg to paint "join areas" ... just need to actually write the code for it. so much to write; at least i know what i'll be doing for years to come ;)

By Aaron Seigo at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

Awesome. Have fun! :-)

By Tim at Mon, 2008/09/15 - 5:00am

I’m using kde 4.1 (kubuntu packaging ) in daily basis. Overall it is pleasant to work in kde 4.1. But there are some annoyances which I hope they will be gone in the next releases. I will start with big ones:
1- There are no a real web browser in the KDE!!
Really, I can not use Konqueror to visit my lovely websites (google (docs, gmail ) , my own website witch has tinyMCE editor , blogspot etc … ) . Therefore, I use firefox which means I’m forced to use gnome (dialogs and applications). I do not care about KHTML or webkitPart because both of them are in miserably statue in kde 4.1.
2- Ark
I want ask the kde developers this question: Do you really use ark in daily basis? Sometimes, I doubt that kde developers use gnome file roller!! Anyway, I hear somebody working on Ark and that good thing!
3- When I download new Plasmoids from internet, they do not appear in plasmoid list. I think this is a bug in kubuntu itself.
3- Spelling check while writing in kwrite does not work !! But when I search in the kde bugzilla , I find it fixed. I want ask, do I miss something?
4- I know this is a crazy idea but do we really need menu bar in all the applications ( specially in Konsole , Kwrite , dolpin ) Frankly, this idea popup in my mind when I see Google Chrome and Microsoft office 2007.

Sorry for my poor English.

By zayed at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

1. You can use or wait for a good webkit integration into konqueror.

2. Ark is right now under heavy development and I think it will be shiny in 4.2.

3a. The download works only for plasmoid which are written in a scripting language. There will hopefully a solution for this in 4.2.

3b. Works for me with 4.1.1

4. Konsole -> View -> Show Menu Bar, you can do the same in many other KDE apps.

By cheko at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

1. Or wait for this:

By cheko at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

Regarding number 4, If I disable menu bar how can I reach the settings option ? I think (correct me if I'm wrong ) most the application settings reach only menu bar. My idea is to element the menu bar and redesign the GUI without menu bar. I (and I think most end users) do not use the menu bar that much unless if we want to tweak something. The tool bar is more than enough most of the user. Just imagine kde without Menu Bar !

By zayed at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

Quoting: (not literally)
> My idea is to eliminate the menu bar and redesign the GUI without menu bar.

Try to design an interface for a program (preferably one with many switches and options) without a menu, e.g. any of the KOffice programs. I don't even know how Chrome handles advanced internet settings (proxy, cache config, or privacy settings *g*), but I'm pretty sure that, to get what people tend to call a "simple interface", you will end up removing options from the user. (There is a possible example in the FLOSS world, but I do not want to cause a flame war.)

My point is: A menu bar is very good for the usability. It is good for organizing a large number of actions (at least if you do not overdose it, 70 actions is a good border from my intuitive feeling). Combined with a toolbar, you can hide most of the possible actions from the novice user, providing him with a standard set of common actions while still enabling the poweruser to use the full functionality of the program. (It should now also be clear why accelerator key sequences are such a natural extension to the menubar/toolbar paradigm: Novice users can ignore them, and they are very useful to powerusers.)

Of course, your point is that the menubar is just unused space for most of us. Yet, I do not see a problem in hiding the menubar as you can always get it back through Ctrl-M. I use this myself in Okular: I need much space to view many text at once, so I have hidden everything (literally, from menubar through toolbar, to navigation pane; I have configured some keys for size changes). In Konqueror, I do only have the address bar visible (which, for me, also contains the navigation actions).

One thing I expect to be promising are round context menus which popup around your mouse and allow you to select common (probably context-sensitive) actions just by remembering how to move the mouse (this is called "motion knowledge" or similar, and is known to be very effective). I always wanted to implement that, but never got to it. Hackathon, anyone? ^^

By Stefan Majewsky at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

Well, I always remove Kopete menu, and add a button for preferences on the icon bar.
Google chrome is a very good example how a interface can be very well designed to work without a menu, it have two buttons for all options, and that is it.

Seriously, menu in apps such as konsole is really strange, and on my eeePC I always use my browser in full screen mode (opera because it's the most fast and that uses less resources I've found).

By Iuri Fiedoruk at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

We should remove the menu someway. At least to bring the Ctrl+M to kdelibs so all applications would follow it. I know that many KDE developers are against it because it "confuse" users if they accidentaly hide the menu. But the fix for that is to make it not to be a activated by default. So when user press Ctrl+M it does not get hided. The "Settings" menu could not include the option for hiding the menu. So for user who wants to have menu hided, they could just simple go first to system settings shortcuts and enable the ctrl+M option so it then would work for all applications.

I love when I can save the screen space and make the GUI more intuitive by hiding the menu on Kopete, Konsole, Dolphin, Konqueror, Okular, Gwenview, System Settings (Default) etc.

But then I hate using Kontact (Kmail) because I cant just simply hide the menu, because I dont need it at all (same for my old aged clients who does not need it at all!). Same goes Amarok, we have three menu options what we dont use on daily basics... we should have possibilities to hide the menu and get clean simple and intuitive user interface if we want.

Reason to force us to have menu (not possible to hide it) is stupid because always there is referred to situations where few users has hided it someway and has not got idea how to get it back. And reasons too that you have important settings in menu, what you should always get change to set.

A) If the setting is important, do not place it to menu, place it to toolbar.
B) If the setting is not used daily or basics situations, do not place it to toolbar but place it to menu.
C) If the user interface must be a intuitive and clean, allow users to edit the user interface (change buttons to toolbars etc).
D) If you allow user to edit the UI, allow them to hide the menu if wanted.

I think we should have new kind menu buttons. More like "menu actions". Idea is that we can add buttons to menu, what functions like anykind drop-down list, but we can edit what is on that drop-down list.
And this "menu action" would act like any other button on menu. It follows the setting of text position and icon/text settings.

Then when we would have the action menu, we could hide the menu bar, and add to these action menus the settings what we want to use from menu. But getting a more intuitive UI if we want.

OR we could make it so, that when the menu is hided, it get added as "action menu" to toolbar as last one. So the menu would never actually be gone. It would be samekind as menu on GIMP when you press the small arrow on the top-left corner. Or addons what you get to Thunderbird and Firefox, to get menu hided.

I use a lot the sub-notebooks (those small 8,9" laptops) and you really need to fight to save every pixel on the 1024x600 monitor. KDE4 is just too big for such monitor. Firefox and Thunderbird are great applications for it because I can hide the menubar and add it as button for toolbar.

Thats why I love those applications what I mentioned earlier, and I dont like the amarok, dragonplayer etc applications, what are unintuitive because they dont allow hiding the menu and configuring the application so well.
I am waiting the Kaffeine ported for KDE4, because it allows me to have player without toolbars just by pressing M.

By Fri13 at Sun, 2008/09/14 - 5:00am

Discussing KDE 4.1 is off-topic here.

Discussing current developments:

1- KHTML is progressing very fast these days, and in other news there is a Qt port of firefox underway.

2- most developers probably use tar in the command-line...

3- what's the point of mentioning kubuntu bugs here?

3- probably fixed in trunk (i.e. 4.2)

4- apparently you didn't know that you can enable/disable the menubar in each application. In konqi/dolphin it's Ctrl+M. In Konsole it's in the View menu.

By ac at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

Number 3 is actually a kde-look bug, but the point still stands. It's off-topic.

By Jonathan Thomas at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

The lack of content moderation isn't exactly a bug.

By Jonathan Thomas at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

ok as a person who moved from windows to linux I don't understand a lot of what I read

can someone tell me what a qt firefox will do different from the current one, which look in Opensuse is built on XUL what ever that is

By anon at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

"can someone tell me what a qt firefox will do different from the current one"

It will use KDE's native toolkit, meaning Firefox will look and feel like a regular KDE application.

By Anon2 at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

> It will use KDE's native toolkit.

Does that mean that Firefox will not take ages to load?

By Stefan Majewsky at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

"Does that mean that Firefox will not take ages to load?"

It should load faster and use less memory.

By Anon2 at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

"Does that mean that Firefox will not take ages to load?"

Firefox takes me 2 seconds to load up on OpenSUSE. Actually I am rather impressed by how quick things load compared to what I used to use, Vista.

By anon at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

I'm also on openSUSE. Firefox loads 8 seconds (cold start) and 3 seconds (warm start).

By Stefan Majewsky at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

Forgot to mention that I do not have any addons installed.

By Stefan Majewsky at Sun, 2008/09/14 - 5:00am

Dude, a Commodore 64 with twin cassette decks would be quicker than Vista :-)

By Phil at Tue, 2008/09/16 - 5:00am

"It will use KDE's native toolkit, meaning Firefox will look and feel like a regular KDE application."

No, it will look and feel like a regular *Qt* applications. As far as I'm concerned, Qt applications stick out only barely less than GTK apps. The lack of KDE's awesome file dialog (Qt's one is nowhere near as functional) is just one major difference.

By anon at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

There was some rumour on k-c-d that Qt 4.5 will allow application developers (kdelibs developers in our case) to replace several standard things, including the file dialog, in Qt applications. Hopefully, Oxygen can become the default style for all Qt applications through this (not that I dislike Cleanlooks, but I want it to be consistent).

By Stefan Majewsky at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

actually not even that. firefox has its own toolkit. it will only use qt for rendering. so the buttons might look like any qt program, but the feel will still be exactly the same.

firefox will never integrate on linux. it never was integrated in gnome. the only thing we may get is a different open/save-dialog.

kdes future is either an even more advanced khtml, or webkit. don't hold your breath for a useable firefox...

By ac at Sun, 2008/09/14 - 5:00am

Is there a way to disable all menubars for all applications with just one move?

By Alex at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

You could recompile kdelibs after applying a patch which sets the menubar height to 0 pixels. *SCNR*

Back to reality: It is perfectly possible to add a global configuration option which would apply to all menu bars. (Of course, applications who handle their menubar manually, will have to be fixed, but these will be very few.)

Be sure to file a bug for this.

By Stefan Majewsky at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

I'm not aware of a completely universal option, however every XmlGUI KDE application (99.9% of them) can have it removed from it's respective RC file. It's usually $KDEDIR/share/kde4/apps//ui.rc; the only one I know of that isn't is Konqueror, which has a proper configuration option. If you want update safety, copy it to $KDEHOME/share/apps//ui.rc and tweak it there.

KDEHOME?=~/.kde or ~/.kde4

By Michael "XmlGui... at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

That will not work if apps manipulate the menu bar manually. If they attempt to manipulate the menu bar, one will automatically be created.

By Stefan Majewsky at Sun, 2008/09/14 - 5:00am

i use ark fairly regularly, actually. it was rather broken in earlier kde 4 release, but it seems to be getting progressively less broken and it looks a lot nicer. when it does occassionally let me down, i revert to the command line. i hope that won't be necessary ever in 4.2 =)

By Aaron Seigo at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

for number 4, vote it :-)


By dienadel at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

Is there a way to disable all menu bars for all applications?

By Alex at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am

ad 1: As webkit is now backed by three major vendors we can expect it to progress quite fastly and get large scale user testing. Therefore, I use firefox which means I’m forced to use gnome (dialogs and applications). Contrary to popular belief firefox is no gnome app.

ad 2: The pieces for the KDE 4.x platform slowly fall into their place. Developers use command line tools.

By Malte at Sat, 2008/09/13 - 5:00am

Thanks for the digest, Danny! Always a pleasure to read.
Is there a plan for a simple app to play sound files, just as Dragon Player for videos? Juk or Amarok are a bit too slow to start when listening to a file you double-click on in Dolphin (this looks like very awkward english but I'm too tired to rephrase it).

By Richard Van Den Boom at Fri, 2008/09/12 - 5:00am