NOV
12
2002

KDE 3.1 RC3: Last Dance?

The KDE Project today released KDE 3.1 RC3 with fixes for several severe bugs in RC2. This RC is likely the last before 3.1 although there remain a few items on the TODO list for KDE 3.1. If you find a showstopper problem in this release candidate not yet listed on bugs.kde.org, please file a report as soon as possible. The download links are up as usual on the KDE 3.1 Info page.

Comments

Ok.. I sat there staring at the unstable/ dir on ftp.kde.org.. then *finaly*.. the 3.1rc3 dir apeard when i pressed F5 for only god knows which time.

Time to let my darling rouge (dual PIII Tualatin 1266) stretch her legs for a while.

After libs and base i checked back in to check if the two most visible points of annoyance was gone.. that was *not* the case :(

1) the icons *still* blink on the desktop (#45472). And now a new bug has come up.. at least i think so.. i cant drag anything onto the desktop.. that is.. it shows that Ø curser over anything and everything i try to drag there. Furthermore it has become persistant that i am not allowed to move my icons at all.. they just "fly" back. This prevents me from "hacking" the above syndrome, as i found out that i could make them stop blinking by pulling one of them a notch out of place and then right-click -> icons -> allign to grid.

2) When using the high-color version of Keramik i still get a blue line at the bottom of every window.

to be continued....

/kidcat

OS: LFS-4.0
Buildmethod: BLFS
Note: i dont use hardcore opts at all: -Os -march=pentium3 -fomit-frame-pointer


By kidcat at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

"2) When using the high-color version of Keramik i still get a blue line at the bottom of every window."

Have you tried deselecting "Draw grab bars below windows" in Configure [Keramik] under Window Decorations in Control Center?


By Morten Hustveit at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

yes.. shit happens.. i typed before i checked.. that blue line is a *feature*
do i need to flame myself to make sure others dont?

ok

kidcat! you @#¤$ stupid cat.. u never do anything @#"& right!

/kidcat


By kidcat at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

> I sat there staring at the unstable/ dir on ftp.kde.org.. then *finaly*.. the 3.1rc3 dir apeard when i pressed F5 for only god knows which time.

I think someone needs to get out more... ;-)


By Per at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

out? where *is* that place?

/kidcat


By kidcat at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am


By perraw at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

> 1) the icons *still* blink on the desktop (#45472). And now a new bug has come up..

You tried what the last comment suggested and added to the report if this is the error source? No.


By Anonymous at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

ok.. i figured out that if i disabled icons on the desktop and re-enabled them i could once again move them and drag files to the desktop.

they still blink tho..

AND i cant make the blinking go away by using the above method..

/kidcat

BTW: the reason (before someone starts bitchin about it) that i post like a madman is because it is *very* important to me that kde-3.1 becomes a Grand Slam Succes (TM). Hell i even vote for a RC4.


By kidcat at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

I vote for RC10, RC20 whatever !!

In the grand scheme of things, if you look back at Netscape 4 for instance, not many people can tell you exactly when it was released, but they sure can tell you how broken it is/was.

People remember IE4 has better CSS support than NS4. Which was released first? I don't know, and frankly it's irrelevant now :)

Delay KDE 3.1 for as long as it takes to make it rock-solid enough for people to remember in the years to come.


By More RC's at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

I second this! Better another RC or two, but then more stable. Anyway: Keep up the good work guys.


By Joersch at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

Could not agree more! IMO most major stable KDE releases are way to buggy to be named stable. Stable is *not* a synonim for usable. Why not just make a release, similar to the final one, with binaries and all, not a one week thing, but name it RC4 instead of 3.1 Final.
In other words, I'm sugesting that 3.1.0 should be renamed RC1 and 3.1.1 should be renamed 3.1.0.

Jad


By Jad at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

Right on! I second, uh, third this 100%. Pleeze, pleeze put stability above everything else. I know features are more sexy, but I'm using 3.0.4 right now and there are still a few glitches. And that would be the fourth bugfix release, right? Maybe it should have been 3.0 RC4.
I love Linux, I love KDE, but for world domination we need a (well, almost ;) crashproof Desktop. I hope the many approving comments on this topic show its importance.
Thanx for KDE!


By sgipan at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

I am in support of this as well. I would love noatun not to crash on me. :)

Stabilty, speed, features. In that order.


By Mark Hillary at Wed, 2002/11/13 - 6:00am

I am in support of this as well. I would love noatun not to crash on me. :)

Stabilty, speed, features. In that order.


By Mark Hillary at Wed, 2002/11/13 - 6:00am

I too agree. I've not tried a RC, I tried a snapshot for a long time ago, and I was very happy to see the changes made on KDE, and since I use KDE every day, at work, at home and on the train, there are no doubt.
I'd really like the version 3.1 come out as fast as possible, but not before it is stable secure and fast. (In that order as mentioned in the reply above)

KDE 3.0.4 still supplies most really needed requieries as far as I'm concerned. So just delay KDE 3.1 until you are absolutelly shure that most bugs are gone


By Jarl Gjessing at Wed, 2002/11/13 - 6:00am

"People remember IE4 has better CSS support than NS4. Which was released first?"

NS4, of course.

When Netscape announced Communicator they were trying to get a technology called "Javascript Stylesheets" (JSSS) into W3C, and Microsoft tried to copy them. Microsoft failed, and re-invented the whole thing, and renamed it Cascading Style Sheets (CSS).

Microsoft then announced a few months before Communicator's release that they were dropping JSSS and putting CSS into their new browser *AND*, more importantly, that it was "on the way" to become an approved W3C standard.

Netscape did the wrong thing: they cried out, hurriedly dropped JSSS, tried to implement CSS within their ultra-tight time frame left until release, failed utterly, and then quickly wrote a Javascript-to-JSSS wrapper hack that could at least parse the most important CSS commands and internally convert them to Javascript "document.write()" command equivalents.

JSSS originally was well thought out, quite fast (at least Netscape employees claimed later on) and technically better than CSS, because most of the rendering stuff could be done by Javascript (and Netscape's support for Javascript was *WAY* faster than anything IE had to offer at that time. Heck, IE didn't even understand HTTP/304 completely in version 4 and kept reloading stuff it already had!)

The CSS-to-Javascript-to-JSSS wrapper is what makes Netscape 4 so ultra-slow when it tries to work out CSS commands. It's not CSS, it's not JSSS, it's the wrapper; it wasn't supposed to be published, it was a dirty hack that was the only solution left. Had Netscape stayed with their JSSS technology, CSS might never have surfaced - but when MS told the world "it's gonna be a standard soon" and everybody jumped, it became a self fulfilling prophecy.

Sorry. Completely off topic but I just couldn't resist. ;)


By Jens at Fri, 2002/11/15 - 6:00am

I am new to KDE and linux in general, but this idea of having more RCs (and thus getting a more stable product) is very apealing :) I am ALL for it!


By A_Newbie at Thu, 2002/11/14 - 6:00am

> Hell i even vote for a RC4.

Me too, as always. I prefer waiting a few more weeks for KDE 3.1 if the result is more stable and reliable. KDE x.0.0 releases tend to appear sligthly "unfinished" and altough KDE 3.0 was pretty good in this respect, IMHO being the most polished x.0 release ever made by the KDE team, there are still some annoying glitches left even in KDE 3.0.4.

Greetinx,

Gunter


By Gunter Ohrner at Tue, 2002/11/19 - 6:00am

Heh, so I wasn't the only one then?


By x3ja at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

Uncheck in the "control-center->Desktop->behaviour->Display devices on desktop"
and the blinking stops. I haven't dug into the code to find out what exactly is turned off or on.


By Turtle at Sun, 2002/11/17 - 6:00am

Hi there, I tried to build kde rc2 on mandrake 9 and, I stopped because I could not even compile qt 3.1rc3, the configuration went fine, althought I was told the -xft option for true types was to be disable due to "internal functional testing" ( the screenshot seems to have it working thought), but the compilation fails. did anyone else encounter the same problem?
take care
renato


By renato dall'armi at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

What was the error you got when it stopped compiling?


By Johan Veenstra at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

Ok.. two smallies from the Multimedia package...

1) Noatun seems to have a tiny issue with internet-streams (is it called ShoutCast?). I have use live365.com as the testcase. It gives a loud click between the songs.. Xmms / Windows Media Scrambler (or what its called) does not do this.
1b) Im not sure about whatever this has been fixed or not since its hard to reproduce: in rc2 Noatun in winamp-mode would screw the visualizasion area when theese louds click happened.. by this i mean that the area just became transparent untill visualizasion was disabled and re-enabled.

2) Kmix in docked mode has a wierd quirk (with "enable system tray volume control"). It wont come up on the first click.. it simply *has* to have two clicks before the slider shows... this can be reproduced by: fist click it, then click around at another app or start something, then click kmix and it comes up.. its not like it requres a dubble-click. Dubble-clicking it also works (oubviously). Personally i dont mind this rather charming little bug.. but all other things in the dock responds on single-click.

/kidcat


By kidcat at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

You really should use http://bugs.kde.org.


By Anonymous at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

a) I will.. as soon as i can set the version to rc3.
b) It has been proved over and over again that posting bugs here too is can be a good thing because they get a lot of attention. In part because the developers also read here. And also because someone with novice/midranging programming skills might see it and thing "now that doesnt sound so hard to fix.. i think ill take a whack at it"
c) what else do u expect to find here? reviews of all the new features? I mean.. its not "news".. its another rc that needs to be pounded like hell.

(sorry for being harsh.. but i help the way i find best.. and im actually clicking my indexfinger numb and rouge is running hotter then ever from compiling everything at least twice before i claim it to be buggy - even intel's make errors from time to time ;-)


By kidcat at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

a) If you can't choose rc3, then use rc2. Older numbers doesnt mean that the bugs aren't fixed.

b) Just because it might work, doesn't mean it is the right way to do it. If noone fixes it right away then it is forgotten, if you file a bug report it will stay on the bug list until it is fixed. Alternatively you could write the correct mailinglist, but they will most likely tell you to write a bug report as well.

And sorry for me being harsh, but to me these bug reports are just noise here. I could understand it if it was major bugs, but in that case the correct forum would still be the mailinglists.


By Troels at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

the bug described is #22186 - and it was marked as closed, reason: fixed....

/kidcat


By kidcat at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

I'm using 3.0.4 and those loud clicks happen on some (local) songs too...
They are always the same songs (no the clicks aren't part of the song...), but sometimes the click went away and returned. I hope it is really fixed. And some songs have wrong reported duration.
OK, OK, i know this isn't the place to submit bugs.


By yuu at Wed, 2002/11/13 - 6:00am

Can anyone put a screenshot in any place of the web? Please, do not put it on that newsgroup, because the servers need autentication and the most of us cannot se the shots.

About having a RC4, why do not releasing final now and error correcting packages after that?


By srs at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

That's like saying: Why not use the car now and fix the brakes later?


By Paul PARENA van Erk at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

It´s not the same thing! This RC may be the last and still there will be errors!


By srs at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

But they said "several SEVERE bugs in RC2"...


By Paul PARENA van Erk at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

It would make KDE no better than Windows. Not the kind of label that you want to get!


By ac at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

Why do you need to see a screenshot of RC3? These are release candidates - they're fixing bugs, not adding features or changing the UI!

KDE-3.1rc3 looks the same as the KDE-3.1 alpha, beta and other RC releases. We don't need to be cluttering up the network with more and more screenshots depicting that which, for all intents and purposes, is the same desktop.


By Vic at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

> KDE-3.1rc3 looks the same as the KDE-3.1 alpha, beta and other RC releases.

Not exactly right: Crystal icon theme got default in RC2 and RC3 changes some icons of it (like Konqueror navigation buttons) again.


By Anonymous at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

Different icons are not something that warrants updated screenshots. One can just download the new iconset to the release that they're running and see that result.

There have been no major GUI changes from alpha1 to RC3 and certainly none from RC2 to RC3.


By Vic at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

Also the klipper icon changed, weird that this is still happening at RC level


By Bastiaan at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

yes, that's certainly worth a screenshot......................... ???


By Paul PARENA van Erk at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

And the Keramik Color Scheme changed at RC2. mmmm... kde goodness


By standsolid at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

http://garaged.homeip.net/snapshots

I have KDE from cvs compiled, last update and compile was last night, and i do it very often, if there is any feature that anyone want in a screenshot just tell me and i'll add it to the list

there is a script that takes a snapshot of the current desktop view every hour.

see u there
G


By GaRaGeD at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

Thanks a lot Garaged, the shots are very good.

As it was proved in the above lines, kde rc3 not only MAY but HAS changed from rc2, and, as much of us defends, there is no problem in seeing its ever improved interface. More than that, not everyone has broadband for downloading and even enought time to compile all those programs. And more, Kde team does not work only for getting a better code, but a better usability according with ergonomic rules. This, in the most times, produces a new design (the way things are organized) and makes using kde ever better and better.

And, there is no problem if I want to use a wm with a good design, usability, ergonomy as a frontend of a powerfull kernel and tools, that, together forms the GNU Linux.

Congratulations KDE team, this promise to be the best kde ever.
Gracias garaged y asta la vista.


By srs at Wed, 2002/11/13 - 6:00am

thanks but... dude! I'm at work!
A Somewhat Inappropriate Splash Pic Warning might have been issued
:D


By spacefiddle at Thu, 2002/11/14 - 6:00am

I am not really on the inside track of kde development, but based on what I see above, I was wondering why kde doesnt do what debian does with stable testing and unstable branches? I mean I dont know how it works with the developers if once a developer is done his/her part of the new version if he/she just starts on the next release changes or if they sit back until the actively developed branch is released before starting development on the next release...is 3.2 development already in full swing? Would it be advantagous for kde to have development and stable branches like debian...and if not why not?


By bonito at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

KDE branches at each major release

e.g. there is a KDE_3_0_BRANCH and a KDE_2_2_BRANCH

These are used for bugfixes and updated translations. That's how we are up to KDE 3.0.5.

If stability and security are major concerns, at least wait until 3.1.1 or 3.1.2 before upgrading and use 3.0.5 for now.


By KDozer at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

Yes, but *after* the release of 3.1 Final will there be any development on KDE_3_0_BRANCH? The point is, a final should be *stable*.
KDE 2.0.0 was everything but stable, KDE3.0 was much better, usable no doubt but IMO still to buggy to be called stable.
I find it hard to believe that KDE3.1 will be stable before 3.1.1 or 3.1.2, so why not just name it stable then?

Jad


By Jad at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

believe it, einstein. it's very stable. if it's not, it means you're not doing your job of testing the RC.

ps why not rename yourself jad beta? you seem unstable...


By ac at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

A 3 phased development model is not very efficient. Also most people would probably wan't to work on the unstable branch as it is there the fun stuff happens. It adds additional administrative overhead. (bug checking, updating the testing tree, testing both the unstable and the testing tree)

If you are so afraid of stability problems, then don't use .0 releases. This is not KDE specific, but goes with all software. Don't use a kernel .0 release, or a gnome .0 release, or a gcc .0 release, etcetc.


By Troels at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

Developers are free to create whatever CVS branches they want to develop new features/ideas while still being able to maintain the 3.1 release. I for example made a Kolf branch for some new features I wanted to add.

Cheers,
Jason


By Jason Katz-Brown at Wed, 2002/11/13 - 6:00am

Is there a list of bugs fixed in this RC?


By desau at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

When I compile qt-copy with -enable-xft I get the below errors. These are with xft2 libraries and development files installed (though the Debian packages at http://verbum.org/~walters/debian/local/i386/ ). I have been able to compile Mozilla and Phoenix with xft2, so I believe my system is in order.

g++ -fno-exceptions -o ../../../bin/uic .obj/release-shared-mt/main.o
.obj/release-shared-mt/uic.o .obj/release-shared-mt/form.o
.obj/release-shared-mt/object.o .obj/release-shared-mt/subclassing.o
.obj/release-shared-mt/embed.o .obj/release-shared-mt/widgetdatabase.o
.obj/release-shared-mt/domtool.o .obj/release-shared-mt/parser.o
-Wl,-rpath,/home/andre/devel/cvs/kde/qt-copy.build/lib
-L/home/andre/devel/cvs/kde/qt-copy.build/lib -L/usr/X11R6/lib -lqt-mt
-lpng -lz -lpthread -lSM -lICE -ldl -lXext -lX11 -lm -lXinerama
-lXrender -lXft -lfreetype
/home/andre/devel/cvs/kde/qt-copy.build/lib/libqt-mt.so: undefined
reference to `FcPatternAddInteger'
/home/andre/devel/cvs/kde/qt-copy.build/lib/libqt-mt.so: undefined
reference to `FcPatternAddBool'
/usr/X11R6/lib/libXft.so: undefined reference to `FcPatternGetBool'
[Snip - Ed.]
/usr/X11R6/lib/libXft.so: undefined reference to `FcFontMatch'
/home/andre/devel/cvs/kde/qt-copy.build/lib/libqt-mt.so: undefined
reference to `FcCharSetDestroy'
/home/andre/devel/cvs/kde/qt-copy.build/lib/libqt-mt.so: undefined
reference to `FcFontSetDestroy'
/usr/X11R6/lib/libXft.so: undefined reference to `FcDefaultSubstitute'
collect2: ld returned 1 exit status

Any clues?


By Andre at Tue, 2002/11/12 - 6:00am

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